How to dob in a doper

[The Customer 2,194]

Asking for a friend...

A friend suspects someone in his training squad is doping. This person has a reputation for being a cheat, such as, cutting the course at the Barcelona marathon and blocking drink stations with their body to hinder another athlete grabbing a drink (they did this at a club race). They have suddenly gone from a 14+hr IM / 6hr 70.3 to someone who will soon break 5hrs for 70.3 and has an insane racing schedule this year - several full marathons, Hamburg IM and 70.3 world champs Nice a few weeks after that. Rumors are flying.

My friend would love to see this person tested at Hamburg or Nice - who do they contact and what are the chances of the testers following through with tip-offs?

[zed 1,468]

Interesting you say that. I'm going to be a bit vague here as I don't want to identify and unfairly accuse someone, age group below me, have raced with them for 5+ years similar standard to me, blew everyone away in a 70.3 race last year. Knocking a decent chunk off his bike PB in shitty conditions and smashing his run PB by 12mins...

You don't want to sound like you've got sour grapes and he gets the benefit of the doubt as far as I'm concerned, it could be he took time off work and trained his arse off. But it does make you think. 

[zed 1,468]

18 minutes ago, The Customer said:

Asking for a friend...

A friend suspects someone in his training squad is doping. This person has a reputation for being a cheat, such as, cutting the course at the Barcelona marathon and blocking drink stations with their body to hinder another athlete grabbing a drink (they did this at a club race). They have suddenly gone from a 14+hr IM / 6hr 70.3 to someone who will soon break 5hrs for 70.3 and has an insane racing schedule this year - several full marathons, Hamburg IM and 70.3 world champs Nice a few weeks after that. Rumors are flying.

 

Going from 6 hours to 5 hours isn't that suss. Loads of people start out, no idea and go 6 hours+. Within a year or so once they have more of a clue and if they have some (not a lot) athletic ability they should get close to sub 5. I'd be more suspicious of big improvements with the top guys. 

Not saying he's not doping, but 6 - 5 isn't that unusual. 

[Shrek 421]

Maybe they have AP coaching them now 🤔😂

[AP 2,296]

11 minutes ago, Shrek said:

Maybe they have AP coaching them now 🤔😂

He wouldn't need the drugs then - all he'd have to do is do the work - do the recovery well - get good sleep - and not focus on others - just look after his own square meter 💖

[Wronggenes 251]

Clearly they just want it more.

[Triatx 186]

TC, As someone who has been through this same scenario while at board level in WA it is an incredibly stressful and in the end wasteful experience.

ASADA sort of had a go on this particular one but because it was Age Groupers they didn't have a lot of appetite for it and it died a death despite the work we put into it.

ASADA don't have the resources and unfortunately unless it is in the public intrest they shy away from it.

Your friend would be better off going direct to IM particuarly as they will test in France.Whoever the person is needs to be put on the their radar so they can look at it.That worked for us with our seriel WA cheat when he went to Las Vegas a few years back.

[AP 2,296]

5hrs is not all that fast for someone who trains - I'm saying going from 6hrs to 5hrs over a year is not that unusual - he probably made a lot of mistakes in his 6hr and has corrected them now😎

[zed 1,468]

5 minutes ago, Triatx said:

TC, As someone who has been through this same scenario while at board level in WA it is an incredibly stressful and in the end wasteful experience.

ASADA sort of had a go on this particular one but because it was Age Groupers they didn't have a lot of appetite for it and it died a death despite the work we put into it.

ASADA don't have the resources and unfortunately unless it is in the public intrest they shy away from it.

Your friend would be better off going direct to IM particuarly as they will test in France.Whoever the person is needs to be put on the their radar so they can look at it.That worked for us with our seriel WA cheat when he went to Las Vegas a few years back.

A WA Ager was doping?

[dazmuzza 198]

Not saying the guy isn't doping, but in 2017, I did a 6:24 half ironman. I then cut more than hour off it in 6 months. Pretty sure I didn't dope. I am a dope, but thats a different story

 

[AA7 1,830]

50 minutes ago, zed said:

Interesting you say that. I'm going to be a bit vague here as I don't want to identify and unfairly accuse someone, age group below me, have raced with them for 5+ years similar standard to me, blew everyone away in a 70.3 race last year. Knocking a decent chunk off his bike PB in shitty conditions and smashing his run PB by 12mins...

You don't want to sound like you've got sour grapes and he gets the benefit of the doubt as far as I'm concerned, it could be he took time off work and trained his arse off. But it does make you think. 

Sounds ok to me.

[dazaau 481]

Character as you have laid out does hint at the possibility they would cheat. 

But drugs wouldn't get you from 6 to 5hrs, your still need to train heaps. And that's still pretty "slow" - no need for drugs and either way requires hard work (drugs don't make you faster without work).

[zed 1,468]

1 minute ago, dazaau said:

 

But drugs wouldn't get you from 6 to 5hrs

Very true. I did a shitload of drugs back in 2015/2016 and actually got slower!

[Stikman 1,796]

21 minutes ago, zed said:

A WA Ager was doping?

Well we did have a doctor from a Leederville clinic that was banned from practice for prescribing PEDs not that long ago didn't we?

[Triatx 186]

And that Stickman is the connection.!!!

[Bored@work 4,088]

I stopped reading at doper & cutting the course......

[BNothling 308]

My PB 70.3 is 5:23 but I know that I have a 5:00-5:05 in me. Maybe they worked really hard behind the scenes and had that mythical race that we all dream of? Maybe it all came together and the guy is just a douche.

[Ex-Hasbeen 8,122]

2 hours ago, zed said:

A WA Ager was doping?

Apparently there's so many cutting the course these days the competitive ones need a new edge.

[BarryBevan 1,545]

3 hours ago, The Customer said:

Asking for a friend...

A friend suspects someone in his training squad is doping. This person has a reputation for being a cheat, such as, cutting the course at the Barcelona marathon and blocking drink stations with their body to hinder another athlete grabbing a drink (they did this at a club race). They have suddenly gone from a 14+hr IM / 6hr 70.3 to someone who will soon break 5hrs for 70.3 and has an insane racing schedule this year - several full marathons, Hamburg IM and 70.3 world champs Nice a few weeks after that. Rumors are flying.

My friend would love to see this person tested at Hamburg or Nice - who do they contact and what are the chances of the testers following through with tip-offs?

"They have suddenly gone from a 14+hr IM / 6hr 70.3 to someone who will soon break 5hrs for 70.3 and has an insane racing schedule this year - several full marathons, Hamburg IM and 70.3 world champs Nice a few weeks after that. Rumors are flying."

 

So they have not broken 5, they might. 6 to low 5 's is not a huge leap  for a focussed under 50 who has some reasonable genetics.

They have planned a lot of races and a friend wants to have them tested, because they might break 5 hours and are going to do lots of races.

Why is your friend so worried about this

[trinube 1,777]

4 hours ago, The Customer said:

Asking for a friend...

Didn't your friend have a similar situation a couple of years back? Same person?

[The Customer 2,194]

Not the same person but living in the same region where drug use is rife.

The suspect person is female and has been about the same speed for the past 5 years. A male breaking 5hrs isn't so extraordinary but for a female it takes a bit of talent. She works full time, has 2 kids and various rolls on the committee of the tri association which takes her time after hours. It's not like she hasn't trained seriously in the past but due to her physical shape and age (late 30s) everyone advised her that she wouldn't get any faster. In the past 6 months she's suddenly become ripped. We'll see what happens on the hilly Nice course I suppose.

[The Customer 2,194]

5 hours ago, Shrek said:

Maybe they have AP coaching them now 🤔😂

She may have been trained AP as she's had more coaches than years in the sport - sometimes all at once 😜

[IronmanFoz 1,653]

1 hour ago, The Customer said:

Not the same person but living in the same region where drug use is rife.

The suspect person is female and has been about the same speed for the past 5 years. A male breaking 5hrs isn't so extraordinary but for a female it takes a bit of talent. She works full time, has 2 kids and various rolls on the committee of the tri association which takes her time after hours. It's not like she hasn't trained seriously in the past but due to her physical shape and age (late 30s) everyone advised her that she wouldn't get any faster. In the past 6 months she's suddenly become ripped. We'll see what happens on the hilly Nice course I suppose.

Just send a note to ironman suggesting she would be a good candidate to test. Only way to find out.

 

[BarryBevan 1,545]

8 hours ago, The Customer said:

Not the same person but living in the same region where drug use is rife.

The suspect person is female and has been about the same speed for the past 5 years. A male breaking 5hrs isn't so extraordinary but for a female it takes a bit of talent. She works full time, has 2 kids and various rolls on the committee of the tri association which takes her time after hours. It's not like she hasn't trained seriously in the past but due to her physical shape and age (late 30s) everyone advised her that she wouldn't get any faster. In the past 6 months she's suddenly become ripped. We'll see what happens on the hilly Nice course I suppose.

So a lady has two kids in her late 30's and has improved. But still has not hit the target and is now ripped and we want to dob on this evidence.

Have we seen her starva or TP data, maybe she found a way to train consistently and get the work done

[Peter 4,222]

I’m guessing she has just become a vegan and hence become ripped.

Probably training more as she is no longer interested in her hubby or kids.  

Is she winning her age group now? 

[more 819]

So this person hasn't even gone sub 5 hours yet and is doing a few races this year.

Definitely sound suss, just shows the incompetence of ASADA. How could they are not already onto this cheat... Amazing... 

[The Customer 2,194]

ring a ding ding 😂

[nealo 1,657]

Who cares? It's age group racing in a pissant sport. 

[Greyman 675]

ASADA, WADA or any other agency, this type of stuff would t be on their radar. 

If you're a coach, pro athlete, Neo pro athlete, registered competitor of sports official, you shouldn't be discussing this type of stuff on a public forum on the Internet. That's what gets the drug agencies attention. Could you answer their question " how do you know? " 

[AP 2,296]

I've got this friend who has all the gear - bikes - wheels - etc - trains really well - but always races poorly - maybe he needs to dope 😏

[Flanman 2,466]

Cheating grows like a disease. The more people are aware of it, the more it happens.

The reason most people cheat is not the consequences of getting caught, it is actually the thought that you will not get caught. The more we think we won't get caught, the more we are inclined to do something wrong.

FM

 

[rory-dognz 805]

As a Tri Australia member i thought i would go to the official website and do a search on "report doping", "report drugs", "drugs", "doping"

I also checked the Tri NSW site as a member and again nothing coming up on a search

This leads to two potential conclusions

1. doesn't exist
2. Tri Aus is not interested in clean sport

 

[rory-dognz 805]

Same search in Ironman gives

http://ap.ironman.com/triathlon/news/articles/2018/11/anti-doping-director-answers-your-questions.aspx#axzz5rL7SldzJ

at bottom has the below paragraph

following the above link, gives a contact address

 

[Bored@work 4,088]

Some people are fking sad if they have to dope for a Hobbie.

 

[Turts 2,977]

19 minutes ago, rory-dognz said:

As a Tri Australia member i thought i would go to the official website and do a search on "report doping", "report drugs", "drugs", "doping"

I also checked the Tri NSW site as a member and again nothing coming up on a search

This leads to two potential conclusions

1. doesn't exist
2. Tri Aus is not interested in clean sport

 

http://www.triathlon.org.au/Membership/Integrity_In_Triathlon__Anti-Doping__Member_Protection__Match_Fixing_.htm

 

Edited June 19, 2019 by Turts

[Ex-Hasbeen 8,122]

5 minutes ago, Bored@work said:

Some people are fking sad if they have to dope for a Hobbie.

 

For a lot of people they would see it as no different to speeding on the road. If you don't get caught (even less likely than speeding) then what does it matter.

[Turts 2,977]

It's under membership on the front page.  Quite comprehensive 

[bengillespie78 6]

In Australia, you can use ASADA page and fill out the form 

[AA7 1,830]

56 minutes ago, rory-dognz said:

As a Tri Australia member i thought i would go to the official website and do a search on "report doping", "report drugs", "drugs", "doping"

I also checked the Tri NSW site as a member and again nothing coming up on a search

This leads to two potential conclusions

1. doesn't exist
2. Tri Aus is not interested in clean sport

 

I think someone like Cranky might disagree that TA isn't interested in clean sport. Two random age grouper tests in one year.

[Ex-Hasbeen 8,122]

3 minutes ago, AA7 said:

I think someone like Cranky might disagree that TA isn't interested in clean sport. Two random age grouper tests in one year.

Has Cranky dissed TC on here at any point?

[more 819]

2 minutes ago, AA7 said:

I think someone like Cranky might disagree that TA isn't interested in clean sport. Two random age grouper tests in one year.

Maybe they heard she was planning on going sub 5?

[zed 1,468]

16 hours ago, Triatx said:

And that Stickman is the connection.!!!

The cyclist with health problems?

[zed 1,468]

1 hour ago, Flanman said:

Cheating grows like a disease. The more people are aware of it, the more it happens.

The reason most people cheat is not the consequences of getting caught, it is actually the thought that you will not get caught. The more we think we won't get caught, the more we are inclined to do something wrong.

FM

 

That's what I've read. But not sure I agree. For me it comes down to your own set of beliefs. You do something bad, it stays with you, haunts you. Hence the reason Floyd Lanids came forward and spilled the beans - 

 "I want to clear my conscience," Landis told ESPN. "I don't want to be part of the problem any more."

If there was no chance of getting caught, there would be a certain % of people  that would cheat, but I don't believe that number would be high. And you can't cheat your conscience.  Perhaps no-one saw you cut the course, but your conscience knows you did. And that little f**ker will be there for the rest of your life tapping you on the shoulder, reminding you. 

 

[rory-dognz 805]

1 hour ago, Turts said:

http://www.triathlon.org.au/Membership/Integrity_In_Triathlon__Anti-Doping__Member_Protection__Match_Fixing_.htm

 

 

1 hour ago, Turts said:

It's under membership on the front page.  Quite comprehensive 

Thanks, I'm glad it is covered somewhere

[Bored@work 4,088]

1 hour ago, Ex-Hasbeen said:

For a lot of people they would see it as no different to speeding on the road. If you don't get caught (even less likely than speeding) then what does it matter.

So is cutting the course as bad as doping? Asking for a friend.

[zed 1,468]

Just now, Bored@work said:

So is cutting the course as bad as doping? Asking for a friend.

worse. At least with doping you've done the course, trained hard, raced hard as opposed to hiding in the toilets for 20mins a la Mark Robson.

I reckon it also depends on the doping, what they were ingesting, EPO vs Ostarine?

[Ex-Hasbeen 8,122]

8 minutes ago, Bored@work said:

So is cutting the course as bad as doping? Asking for a friend.

Worse. And I didn't realise he was actually a friend. Things must be improving.

Edited June 20, 2019 by Ex-Hasbeen

[dazmuzza 198]

Not cutting courses is actually my biggest problem with achieving triathlon success. Every single time I end up regretting getting dessert.   

[Bored@work 4,088]

59 minutes ago, Ex-Hasbeen said:

Worse. And I didn't realise he was actually a friend. Things must be improving.

All my friends are humble and have empathy.

[Flanman 2,466]

1 hour ago, zed said:

If there was no chance of getting caught, there would be a certain % of people  that would cheat, but I don't believe that number would be high. And you can't cheat your conscience. 

Zed, I agree that the number would not be high because as you point out, most peoples morals or self beliefs would stop them. What I am saying is that statistics show that you will reduce rule/law breakers if they feel they will get caught irrespective of the consequences of their actions.

As for course cutting or draft, well I think that speaks for itself.

FM