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O'Grady Retires


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Erik Zabel was one of the most likeable and admired professionals in the sport.

Curiously enough, just read on Twitter that journos reckon he's an asshole.

 

"@BriSmithy In my short career in media there was one rider I thought was an a******.......you have what is coming to you @EteZabel ! What a liar....."

 

Maybe the riders liked him because he obeyed omertà?

Edited by Donncha
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No, just rambling nonsense.   I don't think anyone has claimed that O'Grady or Zabel aren't 'hard men', or that there aren't cheats in other sports and other professions.   The only reason Stuey,

You know, its interesting, I see similarities in the professional peloton to the organisation I joined in the mid 80s.   As history has shown the organisation was entrenched with corruption at every

we all have choices trek. of course he had a choice. just like the bloke who chooses to walk out on his family because he's bored, or it gets a bit hard - granted some choices are very difficult but t

 

.... problem with that is.... there wont be many left... in a lot of sports, and those that are will be the mediocre ones that couldn't cut the mustard (under the you cant polish a turd law of physics) and mediocrity will be the result.... and the public will be left less entertained...

 

 

Not sure if you're making this argument TUv5.0 but this "no dopers mean sport will be less entertaining" idea is complete bollocks. Everybody wants fair competitive sport. They might ride a bit slower but are we barracking for the speedo? Surely closer, genuine contests are more entertaining than one-sided, "mutant" romps?

 

One sided mutant romps?

 

You been watching too much red tube?

 

I saw this really ****ed up video with a dwarf once.... :(

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Curiously enough, just read on Twitter that he's a total asshole.

 

"@BriSmithy In my short career in media there was one rider I thought was an a******.......you have what is coming to you @EteZabel ! What a liar....."

Must be true then....

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Curiously enough, just read on Twitter that journos reckon he's an asshole.

 

"@BriSmithy In my short career in media there was one rider I thought was an a******.......you have what is coming to you @EteZabel ! What a liar....."

 

Maybe the riders liked him because he obeyed omertà?

 

 

Former Olympian, Twice British Road Champ and Pro Bicycler...now TV Cycling Pundit. Co-Founder of the Braveheart Fund. Grand Tour finisher....

 

I spose he is qualified to make such a comment.

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I'm not saying doping is OK - I am saying will the totally clean riders in international sport please step forward - it'll be a small group, they could probably have a meeting in a phone box :shy:

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I spose he is qualified to make such a comment.

Yeah I spose... seeing as he is now a cycling commentator, was on Lances team and of course never doped and has to take a certain viewpoint in order to remain employed.

 

What was that I was saying about social media...

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Curiously enough, just read on Twitter that journos reckon he's an asshole.

 

"@BriSmithy In my short career in media there was one rider I thought was an a******.......you have what is coming to you @EteZabel ! What a liar....."

 

Maybe the riders liked him because he obeyed omertà?

Funny ya know, I don't mind his commentary on Eurosport.

 

The professional peloton looking at it from the outside would be a fairly robust workplace. Hard men and leadership figures emerge, and equally minions and followers. Sprinters of course would be softies that are conflict averse and don't like bumping elbows at 70kmh after fighting for position in the last 20kms and getting their trains in order.

 

You have to be tough and be a leader.

 

In other workplaces, some have similar environments, others like accountants offices, schoolyards and libraries probably don't. Similarly there are those in the more robust workplaces that are leaders (as opposed to managers) and generally these are alpha males. Wimpy types generally don't like that, don't understand it or criticise it. So some retire, throw their toys out of the cot and maybe become cycling journos...

 

Alternately if they aren't failed pro bike riders, they might take up a sport that the guys at work know is hard in an effort to get some cred and/or respect.... so they can tell everyone about it. Problem is they suck at it, but that don't stop these toxic insecure little attention seekers from delusions of grandeur and attention seeking to brighten up your otherwise dull and pathetic existence. Overreaching isn't a problem either.... pulling the odd tigers tail and them crying to mummy when it turns around and bites you. Boo hoo.

 

Lot of these grown up gen Y too much positive reinforcement types in triathlon actually.

 

Oooohhhh Im being cryptic huh?

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You write 'being cryptic' but I read 'dribbling shit'.

 

 

haha Tyno. I've got Tuv50 on block. It's a good idea.

 

I got sick of reading his "The world sucks and you haven't worked it out yet" or "Triathletes sucks" rubbish. His life is shit and he wants everyone else to know theirs should too.

 

His rants of negativity outweigh his great posts on his great bike knowledge.

 

You don't need that negative shit in ya head and reading it in almost every post he does is stuff for brain pollution.

 

and Tony before you type some personal attack back at me, save your anger. I honestly don't read your stuff. I only see it if someone quotes it, which is extremely rare.

 

Be Happy.

 

xx

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You write 'being cryptic' but I read 'dribbling shit'.

You're right of course... but I think people are getting the message.

 

Hey Brian was a shit hot bike rider... he even finished a grand tour once, and had a professional victory in a race now called the GP Herning but it was something else back then... I cant remember.

 

Anyway Im going to go back to working on my retirement plan of marrying some rich chick with a wealthy family and inheriting a street of houses in a waterfront suburb.

Edited by TUv5.0
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Oooohhhh Im being cryptic huh?

No, just rambling nonsense.

 

I don't think anyone has claimed that O'Grady or Zabel aren't 'hard men', or that there aren't cheats in other sports and other professions.

 

The only reason Stuey, Zabel et al have cash to retire on and are perceived to be 'hard men' and heroes, is because millions of people like you and me like watching their exploits. Without us they'd be nobodies. Ask your average Aussie in the street who Marianne Vos is for example? Probably got no idea. Consequently, you and AP's notion that we should be encouraged to blow smoke up their arses when they're doing well, but shouldn't criticise them when we find out their careers are built on a sham is idiotic.

 

You reckon Stuey's our greatest ever cyclist, yet now it's apparent that most of his greatest exploits were drug fuelled. Given Martin Vinnicombe's claims of drugs on the Aussie track team, and Werner Reiterer's book which claimed per-Sydney 2000 that Aussie track & field officials knew of and assisted his doping, plus the issues around Mark French/Shaun Eadie etc. do you honestly believe Stuey was pure as the driven snow until he was corrupted in the nasty European peloton?

 

I get the fact that, perhaps as self-made men, you both identify with the scrapper mentality and accept the fact that these guys did what it took to reach the top etc. Yet, despite your 'hard-man' bluster, when the time came to make the equivalent decision in your professional life, you made the right choice despite the fact that it would put a handbrake on your career, so, deep down, you know right from wrong and that there's an honourable way to make a living. So do I and many others. Therefore, I/we reserve the right to be disappointed and lose respect for those who decide to earn a living dishonestly.

 

The question is, why do you not hold Stuey to the same standards as you hold yourself? If you wouldn't have been able to look yourself in the mirror had you joined the 'brown envelope' gang, why are you happy to still admire Stuey? Why do you feel the need to heap shit on those who don't admire him anymore?

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That's an excellent point..

 

Having thought about it, the reason I still admire and understand those who did what they did when they did in a sporting sense is that they were still athletes that had to work hard and Im not convinced the results were altered. That combined with the fact that sport is something we do and watch for fun although the passion and level of fervour that is applied sometimes makes for a funny kind of 'fun'

 

When contrasted with my job I see a number of differences. You may disagree but that's entirely your prerogative.

 

Having said that too, I joined my job at the end of for want of a better name the 'Rogerson era' and the winds of change were beginning to sweep through.

 

A generation is 25 years, and having now been around for that long I can reflect upon those long term organisational and cultural changes. We also had a much bigger stick to set things right (blokes going to the slammer) and as opposed to professional sport, the rewards were not as great and the actual corruption once the floodgates opened was much easier to detect. Blokes copping quids, being drunk, stealing stuff, perjuring themselves and numerous other misdeeds are a little different in terms of getting the required proof then an army of doctors and millions of bucks in betting revenues etc.

 

That combined with one jurisdiction as opposed to the multi national jurisdiction and cultures that is professional sport.

 

I said earlier that even the good guys got caught up in the bad stuff and had no choice in my job back in that era, I see no differences in cycling, but the adage of letting sleeping dogs lie is also a good one I don't see the open flagellation of others sports for sins 15 plus years ago....

 

A decision was made to focus on the present and the future in cultural change in my job, nothing was going to be gained from constantly hashing up the past (although to some degree due to TV shows, books and other stuff that's happened).

 

Who knows if I had joined ten or twenty years earlier maybe Id have a few waterfronts myself having made the choice to fit in to survive. Im not perfect but made my decisions based on my own compass and was lucky the winds of change were blowing.

 

I see encouraging things in cycling too.

Edited by TUv5.0
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You reckon Stuey's our greatest ever cyclist, yet now it's apparent that most of his greatest exploits were drug fuelled. Given Martin Vinnicombe's claims of drugs on the Aussie track team, and Werner Reiterer's book which claimed per-Sydney 2000 that Aussie track & field officials knew of and assisted his doping, plus the issues around Mark French/Shaun Eadie etc. do you honestly believe Stuey was pure as the driven snow until he was corrupted in the nasty European peloton?

 

Jane Flemming, anyone?

Provided a sample for someone else, at the request of an official.

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Pfft, Pro cycling and these other "robust" work places sound soft... Everyone trying to prop each other up and look out for one another...

 

Some people can work alone and think for themselves.

Guess you have never had to make a life or death decision or lead others in harms way then.

 

Lucky you.

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I said earlier that even the good guys got caught up in the bad stuff and had no choice in my job back in that era, I see no differences in cycling, but the adage of letting sleeping dogs lie is also a good one I don't see the open flagellation of others sports for sins 15 plus years ago....

We know that that's just because other sports are doing their best to hide the fact there's a problem. The genie's out of the box in cycling and can't be put back in, and, as has been pointed out elsewhere, we're our own worst enemies. The French report had bugger all to do with cycling. The names were one section in an 800-page support document to the main report, but the main points of the report were glossed over by the cycling press in the rush to find out who cheated.

 

I could be persuaded that we shouldn't go deliberately digging up the past, but I do think that if evidence of cheating presents itself it should be dealt with properly and not swept under the carpet. In Stuey's particular case, I don't think there's much value in stripping him of wins/medals, but I do think that if he wants to continue with a career in cycling he should face a time-out. I will be disappointed in GreenEDGE if they accept his "confession" and shift him into management.

 

 

I see encouraging things in cycling too.

Me too. It appears that things are going in the right direction, but I think it's still early days and there's still a few who need to be dragged kicking and screaming out of the shadows. As you say, bringing in institutional change isn't an overnight process, so, as fans, we probably just have to accept that there'll be many more revelations over the coming years. It's the price of cleaning shit up.

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TU, you coulda' done a bike session rather than spend hours lobbing grenades! Probably better use of time than posting rants which are helpful to noone including yourself.

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How do you do this?

Under the dropdown with your username in the top right (my profile), go to "Manage Ignore Prefs", enter the name of the user you'd prefer not to hear, and select to not see their posts.

Ahhh, the serenity :)

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Sorry... reality free zone!

 

I forgot.

 

Positive reinforcement only!

 

Just because I don't want to keep reading your repetitive drivel, doesn't mean I'm living in a rose coloured world. You've said most of your main points a dozen times or so at least. I just don't need to read it every 5 minutes. I have a brain that does retain information without daily repetition.

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Under the dropdown with your username in the top right (my profile), go to "Manage Ignore Prefs", enter the name of the user you'd prefer not to hear, and select to not see their posts.

Ahhh, the serenity :)

 

Thanks Peter for the idea, and wardie for enabling!

 

Serenity indeed !!

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Maybe you should just be the bigger man for a change and refrain from commenting rather than pretend you're all peace and love with your "passive" provocation.

 

I have reported this post and will continue to do so with anything related to you two having a go at each other.

 

[edit]

And the same could be said about your signature.

Edited by Rog
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No, just rambling nonsense.I don't think anyone has claimed that O'Grady or Zabel aren't 'hard men', or that there aren't cheats in other sports and other professions.The only reason Stuey, Zabel et al have cash to retire on and are perceived to be 'hard men' and heroes, is because millions of people like you and me like watching their exploits. Without us they'd be nobodies. Ask your average Aussie in the street who Marianne Vos is for example? Probably got no idea. Consequently, you and AP's notion that we should be encouraged to blow smoke up their arses when they're doing well, but shouldn't criticise them when we find out their careers are built on a sham is idiotic.You reckon Stuey's our greatest ever cyclist, yet now it's apparent that most of his greatest exploits were drug fuelled. Given Martin Vinnicombe's claims of drugs on the Aussie track team, and Werner Reiterer's book which claimed per-Sydney 2000 that Aussie track & field officials knew of and assisted his doping, plus the issues around Mark French/Shaun Eadie etc. do you honestly believe Stuey was pure as the driven snow until he was corrupted in the nasty European peloton?I get the fact that, perhaps as self-made men, you both identify with the scrapper mentality and accept the fact that these guys did what it took to reach the top etc. Yet, despite your 'hard-man' bluster, when the time came to make the equivalent decision in your professional life, you made the right choice despite the fact that it would put a handbrake on your career, so, deep down, you know right from wrong and that there's an honourable way to make a living. So do I and many others. Therefore, I/we reserve the right to be disappointed and lose respect for those who decide to earn a living dishonestly.The question is, why do you not hold Stuey to the same standards as you hold yourself? If you wouldn't have been able to look yourself in the mirror had you joined the 'brown envelope' gang, why are you happy to still admire Stuey? Why do you feel the need to heap shit on those who don't admire him anymore?

Post of the day ...

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Maybe you should just be the bigger man for a change and refrain from commenting rather than pretend you're all peace and love with your "passive" provocation.

 

I have reported this post and will continue to do so with anything related to you two having a go at each other.

 

[edit]

And the same could be said about your signature.

 

me? :shocking:

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Reality.jpg

 

 

True Reality

Each person's reality is the life they chose to lead and may only overlap another's in a small manner

This does not make it wrong, for it is THEIR true reality.

Man o man. AP's really gunna hate this shit. :D

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Yep thats life, and as they say "life isnt fair" that very same clause Lance was trying to invoke when attempting to use his wealth and influence to get out of his offences.

 

I suppose its a bit like pleading guilty to a lesser charge to save court costs etc. Lance was going Not Guilty all the way and got done to the fullest extent.

Ok Roxie a hypotheticAl for you .

 

I'll admit Armstrong came across as a bully and did in fact use as you say use his wealth and influence to get out of his offenses.

 

Just say OGrady or any other cyclist you care to mention was as succesful as LAnce , can you honestly say or think that they would have done anything different to protect their "BRand" ?

 

given the number of times O'grady and the others had chances to come clean , the number of times they All Lied to protect themselves , I can't see how anyone can differentiate between them , just so happened that LAnce was the most succesful and had the most to lose and as a result of his success had the biggest "brand" as well as the most resources at his disposal.

 

The reason they lied so many times was to protect brandOgrady or brand ullrich , just happened Brand Armstrong was bigger

 

no matter how much of a nice guy they were , they would have all done the same , the exact same without any shadow of doubt

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The reason they lied so many times was to protect brandOgrady or brand ullrich , just happened Brand Armstrong was bigger

 

no matter how much of a nice guy they were , they would have all done the same , the exact same without any shadow of doubt

But you'd only be faced with that decision if you decided to cheat in the first place.

Who on here can say, as the vast majority have never been faced with the decision to take drugs. All I have to go by is my own choices in life.

I just quit a job where the 'head designer' (i.e. the top paid designer) was always being praised for her efficiency. Only thing was, everything she 'designed' since joining the firm, we discovered had been ripped off from something she'd found on-line. Bosses didn't care.

I suppose I could've improved my output by ripping stuff off too but I just can't work like that. Wouldn't be able to sleep at night.

So, I guess I'll never have to make the decision to lie about my achievements as everything I do has been been achieved without cheating.

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haha Tyno. I've got Tuv50 on block. It's a good idea.

 

I got sick of reading his "The world sucks and you haven't worked it out yet" or "Triathletes sucks" rubbish. His life is shit and he wants everyone else to know theirs should too.

 

His rants of negativity outweigh his great posts on his great bike knowledge.

 

You don't need that negative shit in ya head and reading it in almost every post he does is stuff for brain pollution.

 

and Tony before you type some personal attack back at me, save your anger. I honestly don't read your stuff. I only see it if someone quotes it, which is extremely rare.

 

Be Happy.

 

xx

That's what i do, you know it makes sense.

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So his career is a sham ??. You have no idea about top level sport.

Most of you blokes would give your nuts to be worshipped like you do macca and crowie. So you wouldn't have a dabble to be that person if given a chance. ??

 

His career is awesome in what was a terrible time for world sport.

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Hey trek, how come we aren't allowed to comment on to p level sportsmen but you can comment on ironman?

 

 

He is a better athlete and a better triathlete than 99.9% of the people on this board ever will be..

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So page 18 and O'Grady is still a drug cheat ?

 

Funny heh, some people don't like junkies unless they play sport, wether afl or cycling then their ok.

 

It's a pity O'Grady didn't join the liberal party, get arrested for public indecency in a London toilet then people would like him.

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So his career is a sham ??. You have no idea about top level sport.

Most of you blokes would give your nuts to be worshipped like you do macca and crowie. So you wouldn't have a dabble to be that person if given a chance. ??

His career is awesome in what was a terrible time for world sport.

If you had really big nuts, could you just give one?

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