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Death at Mt Tremblant 70.3

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On the  bike leg

 

Edited by Turts
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21 minutes ago, IronmanFoz said:

Does a medical event refer to heart attack rather than a straight out crash?

I would think so.

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Lots of rumours floating around. 

Car (But was a closed course?)

Deer

Heart attack. 

 

Needless to say very sad. 

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From that it sounds more like an accident.

Doesn't really matter though, it's just extremely sad.

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It's interesting wording. With my ambulance hat on we would only ever refer to it as an "incident" until after the inquest.

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8 minutes ago, Bored@work said:

It’s sad but it seems to happen in about to 15% of Ironman races 

The logistics of covering long course from a medical perspective are horrific. London marathon we had a treatment centre and ambulance every mile. Doing that over a 90km bike course is just not possible. Even at London we lost / lose people despite incredible care. One chap at the finish line had immediate CPR, defibrillation within 20 seconds and advanced care within 3 minutes (the absolute definition of the perfect chain of survival) and yet, very sadly, it didn't work out for him. If you have a pre-existing condition then it can be a dangerous sport.

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Do we really need a post for every death at ironman?  

Whilst sad, people die every day doing what they love. 

 

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16 minutes ago, Peter said:

Do we really need a post for every death at ironman?  

Whilst sad, people die every day doing what they love. 

 

Yep I agree that's why I posted the %

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2 hours ago, Peter said:

Do we really need a post for every death at ironman?  

Whilst sad, people die every day doing what they love. 

 

I think if we did the stats we'd find that lawn bowls is far more dangerous 🙄 that's why I stay away from the bowls clubs - can't be too careful

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37 minutes ago, AP said:

I think if we did the stats we'd find that lawn bowls is far more dangerous 🙄 that's why I stay away from the bowls clubs - can't be too careful

My brother-in-law worked as an administrator in the State Association for a while. They were "remembering" some-one at work every week.

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12 hours ago, Bored@work said:

It’s sad but it seems to happen in about to 15% of Ironman races 

Really?

I know you said "seems to", but it definitely hasn't happened in 15% of the IM, triathlon or endurance races I've done.

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1 hour ago, AP said:

I think if we did the stats we'd find that lawn bowls is far more dangerous 🙄 that's why I stay away from the bowls clubs - can't be too careful

haha

My point is, if you want to post every death in the sport, then get a new sub forum created.

Of course if one of our own died, it 100% should be posted on here.  

But some random that none of us know, well ... maybe not needed everytime.

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1 hour ago, Paul Every said:

Really?

I know you said "seems to", but it definitely hasn't happened in 15% of the IM, triathlon or endurance races I've done.

Yep. I have raced 20x Ironman races & there has been 3 deaths.

Port Mac

Maryland 

Texas 

If you follow the races Facebook page they often get posted there. Local media also cover it but Ironman tend to keep it quiet.

 

 

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I've often wondered what the 'control' for these kind of deaths would be?

Say, for example, someone sadly passes away at the London Marathon once every 3 years (complete guess)... if you took a random selection of 50,000 people and monitored them for 8 hours or so on a given Sunday each year - what would the incidence of a fatality be? 

(Not entirely sure what my point is - maybe wondering if deaths during sport event get a disproportionate amount of coverage)?

 

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7 minutes ago, AJS said:

 

(Not entirely sure what my point is - maybe wondering if deaths during sport event get a disproportionate amount of coverage)?

 

Yes they do. Because it is unexpected, so people are shocked by it.

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30 minutes ago, Bored@work said:

Yep. I have raced 20x Ironman races & there has been 3 deaths.

Port Mac

Maryland 

Texas 

If you follow the races Facebook page they often get posted there. Local media also cover it but Ironman tend to keep it quiet.

 

 

Other than Ian (Port Macq) and Richie Walker (Tamworth "OD" Tri in 1986), I'm unaware of any fatalities from the 300-odd tris (including 44 IM) that I've done.

Maybe it's something that's becoming a more frequent occurrence, with an older demographic and greater participant numbers.

Edited by Paul Every

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14 minutes ago, AJS said:

I've often wondered what the 'control' for these kind of deaths would be?

Say, for example, someone sadly passes away at the London Marathon once every 3 years (complete guess)... if you took a random selection of 50,000 people and monitored them for 8 hours or so on a given Sunday each year - what would the incidence of a fatality be? 

(Not entirely sure what my point is - maybe wondering if deaths during sport event get a disproportionate amount of coverage)?

 

While training for a marathon and the associated lifestyle would be generally beneficial for the health, it wouldn't surprise if someone was a likely candidate for a heart attack, it would be more likely to happen while the heart is under a level of stress. ie running a marathon vs sitting on the couch.

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5 hours ago, Peter said:

Do we really need a post for every death at ironman?  

Whilst sad, people die every day doing what they love. 

 

If it goes to the nature of the events, be it organisation, risk management frameworks, participating demographic etc, then I think it's relevant. 

If not, the mods can delete. 

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31 minutes ago, Paul Every said:

Other than Ian (Port Macq) and Richie Walker (Tamworth "OD" Tri in 1986), I'm unaware of any fatalities from the 300-odd tris (including 44 IM) that I've done.

Maybe it's something that's becoming a more frequent occurrence, with an older demographic and greater participant numbers.

I was unaware of the death at IM Texas until my wife showed me the post on facebook.

ironman South Africa had two deaths in the swim (it was only a 1.8km swim)

Maybe there has been deaths in other races & you just haven't heard about them?

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1 hour ago, Paul Every said:

Maybe it's something that's becoming a more frequent occurrence, with an older demographic and greater participant numbers.

An interesting article (maybe not for some) on deaths in US races over 30 years. 122 deaths, average age 47, 80% male, and 40% in their first race. Also another 13 resuscitated cardiac arrests.

https://coach.nine.com.au/fitness/triathlete-death-cardiac-arrest-statistics/e3329382-d9e8-4a1b-9a92-3b36fd5b9902

 

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5 hours ago, Bored@work said:

I was unaware of the death at IM Texas until my wife showed me the post on facebook.

ironman South Africa had two deaths in the swim (it was only a 1.8km swim)

Maybe there has been deaths in other races & you just haven't heard about them?

Possibly, but I'd be surprised.

Most of my racing is from a pre-facebook era. I think overall the tri scene was smaller and tighter then, or maybe I was just more connected with it than I am now, but given how aware we were of those tragedies I'd be very surprised if something as significant as the death of a fellow competitor slipped through.

Yes, it was a different time, and certainly very different to sport in the US currently.

Edited by Paul Every

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2 hours ago, Ex-Hasbeen said:

An interesting article (maybe not for some) on deaths in US races over 30 years. 122 deaths, average age 47, 80% male, and 40% in their first race. Also another 13 resuscitated cardiac arrests.

https://coach.nine.com.au/fitness/triathlete-death-cardiac-arrest-statistics/e3329382-d9e8-4a1b-9a92-3b36fd5b9902

 

I am yet to read past the title:

      Triathletes are most likely to die during the swimming leg of the race

Either I've been inordinately fortunate over the last 35 seasons, or that should read:

     Deaths in triathlon are most likely to occur during the swimming leg of the race

:unsure:

 

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2 minutes ago, Paul Every said:

I am yet to read past the title:

      Triathletes are most likely to die during the swimming leg of the race

Either I've been inordinately fortunate over the last 35 seasons, or that should read:

     Deaths in triathlon are most likely to occur during the swimming leg of the race

:unsure:

 

That is phrased a whole lot better - I feel a lot better now

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Interesting it's the swim and not the bike. We did lose someone at London in the swim leg and the logistics of water rescue on effectively performing CPR may have had some input, you have to identify they're in trouble (not that straight forward) then effect a rescue into a rib and then onto land before you can start proper BLS. I guess in shorter distances the logistics of the bike are less worrying as the laps are shorter and more people participate in the shorter distances.

What blows my mind is the frequency of exercise related collapse and cardiac incidents as people cross the finish line, at London it can be a bit like the Somme (which is why we have specialist teams to cover it) as people cross the line. Physiologically there can be no significant difference between their condition two metres in front of the line vs two metres over it, the only thing that has changed is their psychological state, they have gone from "Needing to finish" to "I'm done" and that can have such a severe impact on the body it can cause cardiac arrest! They can basically think themselves dead!

If anybody still doubts that mental and physical health go hand in hand then they should come down and watch some time!

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Physiologically there can be no significant difference between their condition two metres in front of the line vs two metres over it, the only thing that has changed is their psychological state, they have gone from "Needing to finish" to "I'm done" and that can have such a severe impact on the body it can cause cardiac arrest! They can basically think themselves dead!

If anybody still doubts that mental and physical health go hand in hand then they should come down and watch some time!

This is so real - anyone who has "raced an Ironman" will tell you - you can be running hard to the finish line and as soon as you cross that line it takes two people to hold you up - as you switch off "the driver" 

I imagine the whole boy's physiology reacts to that thought - we only have to look at how quickly the goosebumps cover your body when something scary comes up in a movie 😮 every thought you have affects the body

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How dare you say a medical event, it was an accident and my research shows that you clearly have had several accidents in the past and you try to pass it off as "a medical event"!?!? Shame on you.

Edited by Dennis....
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 To go back to the 'rumours' part. What if this person was hit by an official vehicle? Is it ok to post about it then?

 

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6 hours ago, Dennis.... said:

How dare you say a medical event, it was an accident and my research shows that you clearly have had several accidents in the past and you try to pass it off as "a medical event"!?!? Shame on you.

Is "you" the race organisers? 

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1 hour ago, Tyno said:

 To go back to the 'rumours' part. What if this person was hit by an official vehicle? Is it ok to post about it then?

 

Thats different. Thats news. 

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1 hour ago, Turts said:

Is "you" the race organisers? 

Everyone knows that @willie owns Wanda Corporation/IM

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This is a bit (translated) from this source

https://linformationdunordmonttremblant.ca/actualites/2019/6/25/une-athlete-meurt-lors-de-lepreuve-de-velo-de-lironman.html

The 46-year-old woman from southern Florida was killed at around 12:30. Witnesses reportedly saw her losing control of her bike and colliding with an event truck driven by a member of the Ironman team who was coming in the opposite direction, the spokesman said. the Mont-Tremblant Police Éric Cadotte.

The investigation conducted by the police department found that the driver of the van, which was traveling at very low speed, was not at fault in the accident.

Several people witnessed the scene on Duplessis Road, near P3 parking, which allowed the investigators to trace the course of events, it seems.

According to the initial findings, the victim would have started to trample on the road following what could be a malaise or mechanical breakage. The bike was subsequently in the path of the vehicle causing the collision. The van was occupied by one person responsible for picking up signposts.

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So it comes down to did she lose control and end up under thevan or was she in control and ended up under the van. 

 

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On 24/06/2019 at 12:33 AM, IronmanFoz said:

Does a medical event refer to heart attack rather than a straight out crash?

Did you see the crash?  Did anybody here see or know anything about the crash that can be helpful in the investigation that killed Jill Morris, wife and and mother of two boys.  It was a senseless and preventable death and now this family is left with not only grief, but serious questions that need to be answered.  Please, if anyone saw this crash, please contact me.    Even the smallest amount of information would be helpful.  Thank you.

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