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Kona now has wave starts

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What's the bet they also find more room on the pier for extra bikes now that they've "solved" the drafting problem.

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3 minutes ago, Ex-Hasbeen said:

What's the bet they also find more room on the pier for extra bikes now that they've "solved" the drafting problem.

After talking with a couple of the officials at Ironman this week. I’m not going to take that bet

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1 hour ago, ironpo said:

Yahoo 

Does that search engine still exist?

anyway. 

Quote

Starting this year Ironman will seek to alleviate those issues in Kona by sending the race off in 11 waves. There will be no changes to the start times for the pro men and women - the pro men will head off at 6:25 AM, followed by the pro women at 6:30. The PC/ open exhibition and handcycle divisions will leave at 6:35. The first age group wave will start at 6:55.
 
“The swim start change is a reflection of, and reaction to, the extraordinary ability of our Ironman World Championship athletes,” said Andrew Messick, Ironman president & CEO in a press release. “While we appreciate the simplicity and iconic visual of the mass start, our primary responsibility is to create a fair race for all athletes. A single start each for age-group men and age-group women creates too much density on the bike course.”

The cut off times for the race remain unchanged: 2:20 for the swim, 10:30 for the bike and 17 hours for the finish.
 

So glad I did it when it was a mass start. 

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I am not entirely sure with those planned wave starts it is going to alleviate the drafting issue. There is only 5 mins gap between each start. 

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6:25 MPRO 
6:30 FPRO 
6:35 PC OPEN / HC 
6:55 M18-39 
7:00 M40-44 
7:05 M45-49 
7:10 M50+ 
7:15 F18-39 
7:20 F40-54 
7:25 F55+ 
7:30 Legacy 

The race will officially conclude at 12:30 a.m., with each athlete facing individual cutoff times based on their starting wave.

The pros will have finished their swim before the later waves even start.

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8 minutes ago, Bored@work said:

Why would they not roll legacy into normal age groups? 

Agree. That’s just weird. 

If the reason is they are slower in the swim they need to put the PC people right at the back. 

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52 minutes ago, Ironnerd said:

The race will officially conclude at 12:30 a.m., with each athlete facing individual cutoff times based on their starting wave.

If they have the technology to know each athlete's actual start-time, and therefore work out their individual cut-off times, in real-time while the race is underway, they'd better start thinking of a new excuse as to why they can't transfer race entries better than they do now.

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4 hours ago, Bored@work said:

Why would they not roll legacy into normal age groups? 

Can you podium an age group if you are in Legacy ?

FM

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9 minutes ago, Flanman said:

Can you podium an age group if you are in Legacy ?

FM

Yes.  But good luck

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4 hours ago, MissJess said:

I am not entirely sure with those planned wave starts it is going to alleviate the drafting issue. There is only 5 mins gap between each start. 

It may reduce it? But with 2500 athletes racing it will still be bad. Similar amount of athletes in South Africa last year and it was pretty bad. 

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This is probably the best realistic scenario, and its good to see them taking some action.

Now for a 20m draft zone for the pros....

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6 hours ago, MissJess said:

I am not entirely sure with those planned wave starts it is going to alleviate the drafting issue. There is only 5 mins gap between each start. 

 

1 hour ago, zed said:

It may reduce it? But with 2500 athletes racing it will still be bad. Similar amount of athletes in South Africa last year and it was pretty bad. 

Here are some numbers that suggest it will help

https://teamemj.com/ironman-world-championships/

 

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2 hours ago, The Customer said:

Watch the women's age group times get a little slower 🙂

If they split it to 2 days then you’ll really see times get slower. Both men and women 

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Weak as piss, ironman is about the survival of the fittest which includes a physical swim.  Just a joke how they continue to soften the sport, this is the worst decision since they pissed on their own history and left Waikiki in 81.  

On a serious note, anything that makes it more enjoyable for a majority of people is a good thing regardless of the sports history and mass starts... the days of Ironman being a single day challenge are long gone with the elites only taking 8 hours so if they can improve the customer experience through changing the swim a tiny tiny little bit, that's great.  

Three cheers for IM

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Nope. Taupo is still hanging in there. Love the Taupo swim. 

12 minutes ago, FatPom said:

Is Lanza the last mass start now?

 

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9 minutes ago, iFoz said:

Nope. Taupo is still hanging in there. Love the Taupo swim. 

 

they wouldnt change taupo, its thats wide its almost like having a lane to yourself

Edited by Oompa Loompa

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17 minutes ago, Oompa Loompa said:

they wouldnt change taupo, its thats wide its almost like having a lane to yourself

Tipping they will. 

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25 minutes ago, Bored@work said:

Tipping they will. 

I hope you’re off the mark there Bored@.

It’s only rough and tumble for the first km in the  swim then it settles.  I’ve not witnessed a big drafting problem at Taupo, in the three times I’ve raced there. 

 

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3 minutes ago, iFoz said:

I hope you’re off the mark there Bored@.

It’s only rough and tumble for the first km in the  swim then it settles.  I’ve not witnessed a big drafting problem at Taupo, in the three times I’ve raced there. 

 

I’m happy to bet on this one. I posted Kona would go to a rolling swim or age group wave start back when they started introducing the rolling swim starts. It’s only a matter of time. 

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Agreed. I saw there was another death in a US 70.3 on the weekend. Insurance companies will be getting nervous with swim safety in IM races

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13 minutes ago, Mr Flower said:

Agreed. I saw there was another death in a US 70.3 on the weekend. Insurance companies will be getting nervous with swim safety in IM races

As many die in marathons etc as well. They'd only get nervous if they were crashing, getting hit by cars etc... But heart attack and the like really isn't that big a deal. People have em everywhere. 

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2 hours ago, Mr Flower said:

Agreed. I saw there was another death in a US 70.3 on the weekend. Insurance companies will be getting nervous with swim safety in IM races

rolling start swim

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2 hours ago, willie said:

As many die in marathons etc as well. They'd only get nervous if they were crashing, getting hit by cars etc... But heart attack and the like really isn't that big a deal. People have em everywhere. 

No they don't. i think the stats show that marathon deaths are half the rate of tri deaths.

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6 hours ago, FatPom said:

No they don't. i think the stats show that marathon deaths are half the rate of tri deaths.

Is that because a response is quicker when running a marathon than 400 meters from shore in a swim?  Are there any stats on the numbers of heart attacks per 100 participants etc.? 

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49 minutes ago, pieman said:

Is that because a response is quicker when running a marathon than 400 meters from shore in a swim?  Are there any stats on the numbers of heart attacks per 100 participants etc.? 

Yep. I wouldn't have posted my answer without back up. (rare on here I know!)

https://undark.org/2016/07/14/triathlon-death-rate-competition-endurance-sport/

 

 

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There has been much discussion about this in the 'Women for Tri' facebook group. Some whinging that it will be so much hotter and windier for the females and that it isnt fair they go after the men. I tried to argue that 20mins isnt really going to make any difference etc etc. One particular lady was very adamant that women are being made to feel inferior, she was very unhappy. I got a bit sick of her whinging so I suggested that maybe the women go last as they need more time to do their hair and makeup. She wouldnt converse with me after that comment :)

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1 minute ago, AA7 said:

There has been much discussion about this in the 'Women for Tri' facebook group. Some whinging that it will be so much hotter and windier for the females and that it isnt fair they go after the men. I tried to argue that 20mins isnt really going to make any difference etc etc. One particular lady was very adamant that women are being made to feel inferior, she was very unhappy. I got a bit sick of her whinging so I suggested that maybe the women go last as they need more time to do their hair and makeup. She wouldnt converse with me after that comment :)

Ah, Ms Harris no doubt.

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28 minutes ago, FatPom said:

Ah, Ms Harris no doubt.

Oh good guess. Do you know her?

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39 minutes ago, AA7 said:

There has been much discussion about this in the 'Women for Tri' facebook group. Some whinging that it will be so much hotter and windier for the females and that it isnt fair they go after the men. I tried to argue that 20mins isnt really going to make any difference etc etc. One particular lady was very adamant that women are being made to feel inferior, she was very unhappy. I got a bit sick of her whinging so I suggested that maybe the women go last as they need more time to do their hair and makeup. She wouldnt converse with me after that comment :)

EVERYBODY is going to be out there during the hottest part of the day, even the pro men. By starting later, the women will actually be running later, so it will actually work to their benefit.

As Bored@ said, some people are just looking for something to be angry about.

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2 minutes ago, Ex-Hasbeen said:

EVERYBODY is going to be out there during the hottest part of the day, even the pro men. By starting later, the women will actually be running later, so it will actually work to their benefit.

As Bored@ said, some people are just looking for something to be angry about.

Only a man would say something so insensitive...

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@AA7 It really doesn't matter if the women start 2 hours after the pros.  

They are only racing the other women starting at the same time.  In the same conditions.

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26 minutes ago, Peter said:

@AA7 It really doesn't matter if the women start 2 hours after the pros.  

They are only racing the other women starting at the same time.  In the same conditions.

That was exactly the point I was making in this online discussion. Apparently it is sexist and it means women are inferior.

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30 minutes ago, Ex-Hasbeen said:

EVERYBODY is going to be out there during the hottest part of the day, even the pro men. By starting later, the women will actually be running later, so it will actually work to their benefit.

As Bored@ said, some people are just looking for something to be angry about.

Yep, exactly what I was saying. It's Kona, hot and windy all the time, a difference of 20mins or so will make no change to the conditions. And someone else pointed out, the AG women started at 7.20am last year too, so no change or only slight change for some of them. If anyone has an issue with heat and wind, perhaps they need to rethink their desire to race in Kona.

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20 minutes ago, AA7 said:

That was exactly the point I was making in this online discussion. Apparently it is sexist and it means women are inferior.

Does the woman arguing with you actually go to kona?  To race or just take part? Or watch?

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I think it will work better, hopefully they add more marshals also especially in the first 90km to police it. I raced in 2016 and the swim start was fairly aggressive and I can see how it is very dangerous if someone got themselves in a bad position and pushed down. Personally I really enjoyed the big start but I was very disappointed by how the bike leg was raced and policed.

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1 minute ago, Peter said:

Does the woman arguing with you actually go to kona?  To race or just take part? Or watch?

It has to be this way, if they let women off first then the better cyclists women can latch onto some males coming past and get a huge advantage, this was it keep the women's AG race fair and like said above, they are all racing at the same time. Also, like has been pointed out, its hot all bloody day, 20 mins isn't impacting the race as far as wind and heat.

 

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52 minutes ago, AA7 said:

That was exactly the point I was making in this online discussion. Apparently it is sexist and it means women are inferior.

 

Edited by Gilliga
Dumb comment

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2 hours ago, Peter said:

Does the woman arguing with you actually go to kona?  To race or just take part? Or watch?

Not sure.

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IM Talk interview Andrew Messick on this weeks show. He talks about the need to introduce wave starts to minimise drafting and his disappointment that the spectacle of a mass start has gone.

One of the advantages he points out is that the Legacy athletes will be standing on the beach waiting for their start and be able to watch the pros finish. I'm really excited about this as it will be only time that I will see the pro's all day😀

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13 minutes ago, Ironnerd said:

I'm really excited about this as it will be only time that I will see the pro's all day😀

You get to see them flying down the hill from Hawi. For about 2 seconds as they whiz past at 60km/h+

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3 hours ago, Peter said:

Does the woman arguing with you actually go to kona?  To race or just take part? Or watch?

 

59 minutes ago, AA7 said:

Not sure.

Athlinks her or https://www.obstri.com/

If she's never raced Kona slam her back.  I would

Edited by Peter

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