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KieranR

Online Assesment - Job

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So i applied for a position up here in Karratha / Dampier the other day, its for nothing ive done before, but I have now received an email from the company saying i need to do an online assessment after progressing to the next stage.  I've never done one before so I have no idea what it will cover.  I've got 5 days to do it.  do we have any HR type people here that could maybe explain what this is / what it covers

The role is not for planning like i have previously discussed, but i applied for this after i have been blocked from my manager since coming back from training in the planner role from transferring (still up here in the pilbara, still on the same site actually), so I have applied with another company.

I only presume i have progressed because I am already a local and its a local position so may have that as a head start from the out of towners that may apply.

Thanks

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I’ve worked at BHP previously and have had to do an online 100 question aptitude assessment...  it’s probably the same sort of thing.  Was general questions to assess decision making skills and ethics etc. 

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The online part is usually fine  ( be wary of multiple questions that ask the same thing a few pages later, they look for consistency). You may find this is followed by a face to face pysch test.

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1 hour ago, KieranR said:

do we have any HR type people here that could maybe explain what this is / what it covers

Just HR types trying to justify their roles without adding any actual value......

 

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2 hours ago, KieranR said:

Thats where ill bomb out

You'll be fine mate.  i had a 4hr one once, for a role in Nth Sydney.  I bought a book that had some test scenarios in it. this book was really useful, not because it gave me the answers but because it helped get my head in the right space.

Anyway, you may not have to do that at all. One step at a time mate :)

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As everybody has said you don't know what they are looking for and you can't predict it. So just stay calm, relax and answer honestly. Don't try and second guess it.

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Face to face psych is pretty rare these days.  As Prince said, you can't study for it so don't stress it, just get relaxed, go at you own pace but keep an eye on the clock

They can take a few forms, part of it will be about your personality and will ask lots of questions like do you like chocolate or strawberry flavour, then later on they will ask whether you like strawberry or chocolate to check your consistency as Fatpom says.  Expect some of these to also be ethics based questions - examples could be Do you believe the death penalty should not be on the table for any purpose and choices to agree , agree a little, disagree etc.  Your actual answers will not go back to the company, they only get a report on how you like to work and your best management style to respond to

You'll may also have same basic IQ tests, some may be on patterns, some will be on English and word comprehension, and some may be on numeracy if you will need to work in that area.  Hint, if online and you have the word comprehension and have the time, get a second browser open to look up the words that you don't recognise or understand, but only do this if you have the time - keep in mind that these are designed so less than half of the people will complete all the questions in the time allocated.  

It may sound daunting, however your results are generally only marked against a group of peers, not the general population.  Generally the higher the management / supervisory role going for, the steeper the comparison grading.  Most testing places give you some test questions at the start of each section to show you what is coming up - these are generally not timed and will give an explanation of the answer - so take your time with these

The tests generally cost between $500 to $1,500 per go depending on how marking and report writing is completed, so you're in with a shot if they are spending that on you for a start.  It's only a tool in the overall selection process so don't think it is everything, relax and go get them - oh and make sure the wife and kids go out while you do it - no distractions eating into the time

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4 hours ago, Tyno said:

Just HR types trying to justify their roles without adding any actual value......

 

Haha. I think the same. 

We have to do a whs / ohs survey at my work at the moment. Totally useless. Question 2 was what is the current legislation? Like anyone other than hr give a shit. Total job justification for the hr people 

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I spotted a story last week about the next mining 'boom' and how there is concern over peoples wellbeing. Lots of sobbing about how hard life is when you don't see your mum for 2 weeks , you aren't connected to the internet, you're away from home and you have to work for 12 hours a day. waaahhhh.....

So it's probably the BHP's, Rio's and FMG's covering their arse to try to screen applicants who are not suitable.

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10 hours ago, Tyno said:

Just HR types trying to justify their roles without adding any actual value......

 

as a HR Manager, thats insulting.   The reason these tests are run is to use an additional  selection method instead of just the normal resume/interview method.   Also, you must realise that we often receive over a hundred applications on average for most jobs. This is one of of the best ways to cull the no hopers.  

Unfortunately most Managers do such a piss poor effort in all areas of people management, hence a need for HR. 

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3 hours ago, Prince said:

Unfortunately most Managers do such a piss poor effort in all areas of people management, hence a need for HR. 

I agree. I don't have a full time HR person but pay an advisor a retainer. I'm great at leading, motivating and doing my thing out on the road. I have no interest or talent regarding contracts, performance management (when needed) or dispute resolution. We can't all be good at everything!

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Thanks everyone, Ill sit down in the next couple of days and do it, we have a good distraction at home at the moment, we got chickens yesterday so the kids will be more than happy to be playing with them outside while i do this.

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5 minutes ago, KieranR said:

Thanks everyone, Ill sit down in the next couple of days and do it, we have a good distraction at home at the moment, we got chickens yesterday so the kids will be more than happy to be playing with them outside while i do this.

Good on ya for throwing an application out to  get where you want to be but if you're not successful you need to address this issue with your manager.. isn't she/he the one that wasn't keen to train you in first place hence you needing to talk to their superior?

Managers that don't support staff development/movement usually think they're doing the right thing by maintaining stability and avoiding having to train someone new. However the employee dissatisfaction usually comes to the fore and is worse and the team usually implodes anyway.. and the manager usually gets promoted for it..

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5 hours ago, Prince said:

Unfortunately most Managers do such a piss poor effort in all areas of people management, hence a need for HR. 

Yeah, there is plenty of this, people seem to get promoted to manager because they are good at their job, which is absolutely no correlation with how good a manager they will be.  I've even had to fight in my current job to keep a few people off of the current leadership course as they have next to zero EQ and will be terrible managers.  

But I understand the angst around HR as well.  18 years ago I left agriculture to move to the city and decided to go work in the finance side of business as there wasn't much call for agronomists in Toorak.  I quickly realised how crap the vast majority of HR people were and after a few years of disbelief / having a whinge etc, decided to do something about it.  I've been in HR for just over a decade now and I absolutely loathe the existence of a good third of the industry.  I'm glad that I had the experience of managing small teams and larger teams up to 400 people in my ag days so I know what managers are going through, it shits me no end having to work alongside HR people who go straight to uni and come out calling themselves HR managers without even having at least done some crew management at McDonalds.  

I totally get why Tyno and Peter have said what they do  

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I sent an email to our HR consultant 2 weeks ago to let them know that the Resource request that went into the system was being direct nominated through a restructure our group is doing. I sent no "Success Profile" for the position, so that they couldn't put an advert in the system. 

This week we made contact again to get the contracts drawn up. The next day, lo & behold, job adverts appear online for the positions we've already filled.

aaaahhhh!

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Local Council HR sent our organisation CEO an email exchange about how the Hell were they going to get rid of one of their employees.  Must have entered the wrong Nathan in the email address, nice work esp since we work with the guy in question :lol:.

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2 hours ago, Cottoneyes said:

Yeah, there is plenty of this, people seem to get promoted to manager because they are good at their job, which is absolutely no correlation with how good a manager they will be.

My last boss was so smart. Honestly one of the smartest people that I know.

Then a guy I worked with at the time, his wife was having a baby. She called to say the neighbor was taking her to the hospital and for him to meet them there.

He told our boss and SHE goes, after the 4pm meeting you can leave.  It was 11am at the time.

She was NOT a people person at all but had 14 people reporting to her.

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Kieran, while you can't study for these, there are a few free practice assessments online.  These can help you prepare for timed assessments without panicking about the clock counting down.  It also gives an understanding of how the questions are generally structured, especially numerical reasoning, verbal reasoning, etc.

 

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1 hour ago, Catcam said:

Kieran, while you can't study for these, there are a few free practice assessments online.  These can help you prepare for timed assessments without panicking about the clock counting down.  It also gives an understanding of how the questions are generally structured, especially numerical reasoning, verbal reasoning, etc.

 

Thanks for this - could you share a couple of links to these?

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Sure, here are a couple I've just found online.  I'm not sure how relevant they are, but I know practising helped me feel less nervous when faced with the actual assessments. 

PS I'm pretty sure you've reached the next round for more reasons than just being a local.  Good luck!

https://www.psychometricinstitute.com.au/pre_employment_testing_practice.html

 

https://www.wikijob.co.uk/aptitude-tests-home

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I've just done it, it was 18 questions with 4 responses, i had to pick the most relevant and least relevant for each question.  No maths or anything like that.  Just questions about, decision making and best approach to certain scenarios

I feel i did OK, a lot of it was common sense, integrity type of stuff.

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16 hours ago, Prince said:

Also, you must realise that we often receive over a hundred applications on average for most jobs. This is one of of the best ways to cull the no hopers.

At best it's a broad pass, poorly verified methodology though.

Especially if it is a single tool used to cull people.

 

PS it took you long enough to come back :)

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10 hours ago, Cottoneyes said:

I totally get why Tyno and Peter have said what they do  

I will add, most HR individuals I've met are top people, but the systems they have to work within are abominable.

Especially in my chosen (?) milieux

 

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3 minutes ago, Tyno said:

I will add, most HR individuals I've met are top people, but the systems they have to work within are abominable.

Especially in my chosen (?) milieux

 

Disaree - I have not met a good one yet 🙂

 

 

Edited by Bosco
I

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8 hours ago, Peter said:

She was NOT a people person at all but had 14 people reporting to her.

Hmmm.  Last few companies I've worked for seemed to have a an excess of "managers" who had little or no people skills.  

Maybe thats why they are made managers.  Don't have the people skills to play nicely with the rest of the staff.

AJ

 

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8 hours ago, Tyno said:

At best it's a broad pass, poorly verified methodology though.

Especially if it is a single tool used to cull people.

 

PS it took you long enough to come back :)

if it is constructed well it can be.  I prefer to conduct real work type assessment exercises at the interview. to me the most important thing is 'the fit' of the person into the team.  At certain times a team may need a particular type of individual or manager to balance what they may be missing. One of the best indicators is actually the reference checks from people that the candidate has not listed, however we are not meant to do those. 

...yes, it did take me awhile, as I was too busy fixing up the garbage KPI's that are linked to our bonuses. It makes my blood boil when I see the KPI's managers have come up with for their staff. 

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8 hours ago, Bosco said:

Disaree - I have not met a good one yet 🙂

 

 

you haven't met me yet!

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15 hours ago, Peter said:

My last boss was so smart. Honestly one of the smartest people that I know.

Then a guy I worked with at the time, his wife was having a baby. She called to say the neighbor was taking her to the hospital and for him to meet them there.

He told our boss and SHE goes, after the 4pm meeting you can leave.  It was 11am at the time.

She was NOT a people person at all but had 14 people reporting to her.

I get frustrated at that too many managers put leadership as low importance.  I have a GM who is riding on ego, thinking everyone loves him. Yet they can't stand him as a leader. No urgency, no mentoring and he constantly disappears at 4pm or dashes off to watch his kid come last in their sports carnival.  My solution is to run a 360 degree performance review next time to hopefully give him a shock and kick up the arse. That and ensure his KPI's reflect some real leadership dimensions in the future. 

 

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18 hours ago, Tyno said:

I will add, most HR individuals I've met are top people, but the systems they have to work within are abominable.

Especially in my chosen (?) milieux

 

I agree.  There was one guy in our HR team of 9 that was a ripping guy.  Some on here would even know him.  But he was assigned to another division so I never deal with him officially.

 

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10 hours ago, Prince said:

if it is constructed well it can be.  I prefer to conduct real work type assessment exercises at the interview. to me the most important thing is 'the fit' of the person into the team.  At certain times a team may need a particular type of individual or manager to balance what they may be missing. One of the best indicators is actually the reference checks from people that the candidate has not listed, however we are not meant to do those. 

...yes, it did take me awhile, as I was too busy fixing up the garbage KPI's that are linked to our bonuses. It makes my blood boil when I see the KPI's managers have come up with for their staff. 

Interested to know what an HR managers bonus linked KPIs would be?

  • Increased number of deadwoods put through performance management processes with no change in performance.
  • Implementation of new capability framework
  • Development of new and barely intelligible cultural pillars
  • sent twice weekly emails about mental health, wellbeing, diversity and capability

 

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14 hours ago, pieman said:

Interested to know what an HR managers bonus linked KPIs would be?

  • Increased number of deadwoods put through performance management processes with no change in performance.
  • Implementation of new capability framework
  • Development of new and barely intelligible cultural pillars
  • sent twice weekly emails about mental health, wellbeing, diversity and capability

 

1.  this is the problem. It is not the role of HR to manage performance. If a line manager can't do this, what the hell are they doing in the job? HR should facilitate the process, and with the line Mgr, set clear and specific goals and targets, preferably to be followed up and reviewed in a month. If they had not been met, further warnings and further targets should be set with the possibility of dismissal. 

2. once again, implementing a capability framework is not the sole role of HR. they may devise the method for change, but true implementation comes from good change management methodology which a Manager, Snr Manager and above must implement top down.  

3. No HR Manager should be developing the vision of a new or modified Culture. Process yes, content nup.

4. Emails are to the most effective way to get a message across, however, take it on board, your organisation may actually care about those things, if they practice what they preach.

I am still refining some KPI's however, I believe in quantitative data and measurement, i.e turnover percentage, absenteeism percentage, management of work cover etc.

 

😂

 

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14 hours ago, Peter said:

I agree.  There was one guy in our HR team of 9 that was a ripping guy.  Some on here would even know him.  But he was assigned to another division so I never deal with him officially.

 

ripping? he had a six pack? 

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So, contracts going out this morning for the first 13 successful candidates. The first 5 have been generated and sent by HR, and not a single one matches the details they had me put in the table for them. Four have the wrong manager against them, and the only one with the right manager, has the wrong work address.

FFS. Get something right please.

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On 28/09/2018 at 4:33 AM, Ex-Hasbeen said:

So, contracts going out this morning for the first 13 successful candidates. The first 5 have been generated and sent by HR, and not a single one matches the details they had me put in the table for them. Four have the wrong manager against them, and the only one with the right manager, has the wrong work address.

FFS. Get something right please.

No doubt there will be a ‘self help’ portal where it will all become your fault :wallbash:

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On 25/09/2018 at 10:36 PM, softy said:

I spotted a story last week about the next mining 'boom' and how there is concern over peoples wellbeing. Lots of sobbing about how hard life is when you don't see your mum for 2 weeks , you aren't connected to the internet, you're away from home and you have to work for 12 hours a day. waaahhhh.....

So it's probably the BHP's, Rio's and FMG's covering their arse to try to screen applicants who are not suitable.

Mental health issues in the FIFO mining industry are not something to be made fun of. A number of studies have shown that mental health problems are more prevalent among FIFO workers than the general population.

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5 minutes ago, Ironnerd said:

Mental health issues in the FIFO mining industry are not something to be made fun of. A number of studies have shown that mental health problems are more prevalent among FIFO workers than the general population.

Totally agree. It's not just FIFO it's anybody who spends extended periods of time away from home for work. The whole "waaaahhhh boo hoo" approach to these kind of things is part of the reason why suicide is the most common cause of death in 15 - 44 year olds in Australia.

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20 minutes ago, monkie said:

Totally agree. It's not just FIFO it's anybody who spends extended periods of time away from home for work. The whole "waaaahhhh boo hoo" approach to these kind of things is part of the reason why suicide is the most common cause of death in 15 - 44 year olds in Australia.

Divorce & alcoholism were rife through the teams I used to travel with in my earlier years. I got out while I was still young. The guys still doing it in their 40's were doing it tough.

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