Jump to content
monkie

Single Sided Power?

Recommended Posts

About to take the plunge and buy powertap P1 pedals.

The full set is on Wiggle for $1168.

Pushys have the single sided for $770.

That's $400 ish different... should I go for the full or is the half OK?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've got a single sided stages, I notice about a 10% difference in power between it and my trainer when doing close to threshold. bit closer when taking it easier. But i think that is due to an old injury on my left knee

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, monkie said:

About to take the plunge and buy powertap P1 pedals.

The full set is on Wiggle for $1168.

Pushys have the single sided for $770.

That's $400 ish different... should I go for the full or is the half OK?

Think its fine, as long as it is giving consistent numbers then it doesn't matter if that number is high or low.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, monkie said:

Just found a double sided set for $972... I think that might be a deal maker...

What site?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, BarryBevan said:

Think its fine, as long as it is giving consistent numbers then it doesn't matter if that number is high or low.

yeah this. It's only an issue when you're talking to others about numbers. My mate had a ridiculously high FTP, like elite level which I was curious about, because he's no gun on the bike, he then upgraded his PM and his FTP dropped 150W!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Find ridin in races or fast bunches under pressure delivers really good pedalling technique that is smooth. Sitting on trainer with number makes the punchy one leg worse.

If leg 2 is stronger or weaker then there will be error. How much will that error impact race or training only you can tell, suggest that unless you are on the limit then 5 % should not matter much. Lots of AG over estimate power they can deliver anyway so the error from a single side is probably not a major driver in performance. I just want the pedals to be less than 500 bucks or second hand people to price them low

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, zed said:

yeah this. It's only an issue when you're talking to others about numbers. My mate had a ridiculously high FTP, like elite level which I was curious about, because he's no gun on the bike, he then upgraded his PM and his FTP dropped 150W!

That's a very big delta, even the worst PM should not read that bad. I jave one of those jet black whisper drive (sigh). Now I know it over reports power and has major issues (but so did gen 1 wahoo). I use it with my power 2 max and find its solid at up to 200 then until it warms up a bit over the shop under effort and then at TH reads about 20 watts high.

Bit slow to respond this applies to power coming down and up, so evens out. I stopped worrying about the accuracy and just used the number to work hard. Then ride in fast bunches and did a crit, power is just fine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, BarryBevan said:

That's a very big delta, even the worst PM should not read that bad. I jave one of those jet black whisper drive (sigh). Now I know it over reports power and has major issues (but so did gen 1 wahoo). I use it with my power 2 max and find its solid at up to 200 then until it warms up a bit over the shop under effort and then at TH reads about 20 watts high.

Bit slow to respond this applies to power coming down and up, so evens out. I stopped worrying about the accuracy and just used the number to work hard. Then ride in fast bunches and did a crit, power is just fine.

It was power from a smart trainer. Perhaps it wasn't calibrated properly? Or a Zwift issue? He only recently got a bike PM and had a bit of a reality check!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, zed said:

It was power from a smart trainer. Perhaps it wasn't calibrated properly? Or a Zwift issue? He only recently got a bike PM and had a bit of a reality check!

zwift, trainer road and smart trainers all appear to have issues. Response time, accuracy. 150 is huge though. I don't knwo wjat is going on at the API level but I think there are issues with all of these apps and the code in the smart trainers.

https://support.zwift.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/115018666823-Calibration-ruining-everything-

The hardware for the smart trainers is also a bit lower quality than a proper power meter and then to vary at more extreme watts. But these things are shipping at low 1000 and they are more than a PM. Most people I know who have wahoos report 20 to 30 reading high.

This stuff is really buggy, app, platform, api hardware. Reckon its best to enjoy the training and not worry too much, but get out and ride on the road in some races to make sure reality is grounded

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, BarryBevan said:

Think its fine, as long as it is giving consistent numbers then it doesn't matter if that number is high or low.

If only that were true or indeed knowable.

The reality is it represents an unknown variable error in power data.

Whether that unknown error matters depends on what you intend to use the data for. I'd suggest that if the data use is such that a single sided meter is all one thinks they need, then they can most likely do just as well without a meter at all. But as an initial foray to learn about some principles of training with power, then it has a role as a gateway drug.

Edited by Alex Simmons

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Alex Simmons said:

If only that were true or indeed knowable.

The reality is it represents an unknown variable error in power data.

Whether that unknown error matters depends on what you intend to use the data for. I'd suggest that if the data use is such that a single sided meter is all one thinks they need, then they can most likely do just as well without a meter at all. But as an initial foray to learn about some principles of training with power, then it has a role as a gateway drug.

if it gives measure with a consistent error?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

do you recommend ditching smart trainers. I've ridden, whaoo, jet black and elite and they are all out compared to a power 2 max.

Is power 2 max wrong? which meters are right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Going back out on the road for next 12 weeks. The industry can't make these things good, DC rainmaker guy writes bias reviews. On one of the wahoo's he states +- 3 % when the graph showe it out by 20 to 30 and some times, more, conlcude what you will.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Willie has done his magic and I have a pair of double siders on the way! I guess this means I will have to actually ride outside...

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, monkie said:

Willie has done his magic and I have a pair of double siders on the way! I guess this means I will have to actually ride outside...

so does willie sell stuff on the cheap?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, BarryBevan said:

so does willie sell stuff on the cheap?

As a Trannie he'll do you a deal I'm sure :) To be honest he was a bit more pricey than the cheapest I found but it's a better product and it comes from a source I trust! Also, for a small difference in the big scheme of things I'd rather buy through a mate.

Edited by monkie
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, BarryBevan said:

if it gives measure with a consistent error?

It can't, that's the point.

5 hours ago, BarryBevan said:

do you recommend ditching smart trainers. I've ridden, whaoo, jet black and elite and they are all out compared to a power 2 max.

I don't suggest ditching anything. Whether the data is of any use is another matter. They still provide resistance and help to make indoor training more bearable. 

5 hours ago, BarryBevan said:

Is power 2 max wrong? which meters are right?

I don't know. Have you done a slope calibration check of your P2M?

I don't assume any meter is correct unless I've at least performed a basic slope calibration check. It'd be a bugger if it was out since the P2M doesn't permit a slope adjustment but at least you'd know by how much.

Edited by Alex Simmons

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, monkie said:

About to take the plunge and buy powertap P1 pedals.

The full set is on Wiggle for $1168.

Pushys have the single sided for $770.

That's $400 ish different... should I go for the full or is the half OK?

Both. 

If I could save for it then anyone can 😂😂😂😂*

I find the left/right balance number interesting, especially recovering from my ankle injury. 

 

*Apologies if you have money flow issues. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, BarryBevan said:

hich meters are right?

In lieu of IP... 

 

SRM thread closed 😁😁😎🤘👌

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, FFF1077 said:

Both. 

If I could save for it then anyone can 😂😂😂😂*

I find the left/right balance number interesting, especially recovering from my ankle injury. 

 

*Apologies if you have money flow issues. 

I don't save I buy, money flows mainly out. I'm going to get off the trainer for a while ride the hard bunches, do crits. While I agree the tech is clearly better the more you spend. 

I'm a bit over gaslighting behaviour from experts, coaches tech heads where the only answer is what ever suits their commercial position or need to be worshipped. 

If you went back 25 years you probably would have had serious advantage with a singe sided pedal PM.

Insert : 1989 SRM Lemond (best to do the gaslighting yourself)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×