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HFLC ruined my life......

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A newly-released study tracked nearly 14,000 people for more than two decades. It found that people on low-carb diets were 18 percent more likely to develop atrial fibrillation, a common heart rhythm disorder, than people on a moderate-carb diet.

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2019/03/06/10/29/low-carb-diet-tied-to-common-heart-rhythm-disorder

https://abcnews.go.com/wellness/story/low-carb-diets-keto-linked-potential-heart-risk-61528616?cid=clicksource_4380645_11_post_hero_card_hed

 

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5 minutes ago, Ironnerd said:

A newly-released study tracked nearly 14,000 people for more than two decades. It found that people on low-carb diets were 18 percent more likely to develop atrial fibrillation, a common heart rhythm disorder, than people on a moderate-carb diet.

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2019/03/06/10/29/low-carb-diet-tied-to-common-heart-rhythm-disorder

https://abcnews.go.com/wellness/story/low-carb-diets-keto-linked-potential-heart-risk-61528616?cid=clicksource_4380645_11_post_hero_card_hed

 

Zhuang said that while the research shows an association, it cannot prove cause and effect. A randomized controlled trial would be needed to confirm the relationship between carbohydrate intake and AFib and assess the effect in a more ethnically diverse population. In addition, the study did not track participants with asymptomatic AFib or those who had AFib but were never admitted to a hospital, nor did it investigate different subtypes of AFib, so it is unknown whether patients were more likely to have occasional episodes of arrhythmia or persistent AFib. The study did not account for any changes in diet that participants may have experienced after completing the questionnaire.

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On 08/03/2019 at 8:25 AM, RunBrettRun said:

Zhuang said that while the research shows an association, it cannot prove cause and effect. A randomized controlled trial would be needed to confirm the relationship between carbohydrate intake and AFib and assess the effect in a more ethnically diverse population. In addition, the study did not track participants with asymptomatic AFib or those who had AFib but were never admitted to a hospital, nor did it investigate different subtypes of AFib, so it is unknown whether patients were more likely to have occasional episodes of arrhythmia or persistent AFib. The study did not account for any changes in diet that participants may have experienced after completing the questionnaire.

All research has caveats on the results.

14,000 people over 2 decades with an 18% increase in atrial  fibrillation suggests to me that for some people a low carb diet increases the risk of heart problems.

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47 minutes ago, Ironnerd said:

All research has caveats on the results.

14,000 people over 2 decades with an 18% increase in atrial  fibrillation suggests to me that for some people a low carb diet increases the risk of heart problems.

Do people on low carb diets exercise the same amount as people on "normal" carb diets? If not, then you could correlate low exercise with heart problems

May not be true - just an example of why correlation does not equal causation

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10 minutes ago, BogFrog said:

Do people on low carb diets exercise the same amount as people on "normal" carb diets? If not, then you could correlate low exercise with heart problems

May not be true - just an example of why correlation does not equal causation

The study itself points out that correlation does not equal causation. "Zhuang said that while the research shows an association, it cannot prove cause and effect."

14,000 people over 2 decades with an 18% increase in atrial  fibrillation. This is a large enough study with a large enough difference that I think that some of the increased risk is due to causation, not correlation.

If you want to enjoy some funny correlations check out the website:

Spurious Correlations

 

SP.JPG

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For those lchf adapted, how are you fuelling long races and sessions at rp. 

I am in the process of adapting and hearing about super starches but need to research more whats available.

Keen to hear what others are trying.

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IM

Bike - 1 pack of chomps per hour (48g carb). Also have aero bottle with one First Endurance flask in it (100g of carbs) + water to have a sip of. Approx 55g carb/hr

Run - 1 chomp every 2km.

 

Training

Most long aerobic sessions fasted or something from a cafe at the back end.

Some long race pace sessions nothing (I.e. yesterday 2.40hr ergo with 4x30min @ IM pace just water). Others, 1 pack of chomps per hour.

Be very very careful surrounding total caloric load if taking on minimal calories in sessions though. Very very easy to end a day in a huge deficit and if you keep doing that, it will only last so long. I am about to write a blog surrounding my experiences with HFLC and that is one of the biggest challenges for me.

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Also, I recently heard Dave Scott saying that those who eat low carb shouldn’t need any carbs in a race. I call absolute bullshit. If you want to race well, you should have some carbs. My personal choice to train to have less is surrounding chronic gut issues in trying to have more than 50-60g/hr. I think you’ll also find there is a big difference between lower carb and “keto”. Be careful of trying to stay under an arbitrary ‘ceiling’.

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Thanks Lachie good insights. I have had GI issues too and also seeing if the change reduces inflammation.

DS is with SFuels, their mix is 4g fat, 3g protein and 2g carbs. I'm pretty sure I have heard Dan Plews (also linked to Sfuels) talk about some of his athletes race fuelling off coke.

When I'm closer to racing I might get fat oxidation tested too backsolve varb needs, although not many options for MET testing in Sydney?

UCAN superstarch seems popular as a lchf fuel too.

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8 hours ago, Kiwinoz said:

Thanks Lachie good insights. I have had GI issues too and also seeing if the change reduces inflammation.

DS is with SFuels, their mix is 4g fat, 3g protein and 2g carbs. I'm pretty sure I have heard Dan Plews (also linked to Sfuels) talk about some of his athletes race fuelling off coke.

When I'm closer to racing I might get fat oxidation tested too backsolve varb needs, although not many options for MET testing in Sydney?

UCAN superstarch seems popular as a lchf fuel too.

My personal opinion is keep it simple and use what works for you!

I’ve never used SFuels but with that fat content, I’d highly recommend trying first as it could cause some issues ‘at the back end’ if you know what I mean

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I've had it at both ends...

I am going to give UCAN Superstarch at Gold Coast Marathon, it is a B race for me and I should be fairly well adapted by then. 

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On 01/05/2019 at 9:04 AM, Kiwinoz said:

I've had it at both ends...

I am going to give UCAN Superstarch at Gold Coast Marathon, it is a B race for me and I should be fairly well adapted by then. 

Off that!

 https://www.classaction.org/news/class-action-says-the-ucan-companys-superstarch-claims-are-misleading-deceptive

Will just test basic maltodextrin/dextrose at sustainable levels ~<60g an hour

 

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24 minutes ago, Kiwinoz said:

Off that!

 https://www.classaction.org/news/class-action-says-the-ucan-companys-superstarch-claims-are-misleading-deceptive

Will just test basic maltodextrin/dextrose at sustainable levels ~<60g an hour

 

I think @RunBrettRun ( one of this sites resident gurus at LCHF endurance and 'training low racing high') uses Tailwind..

but he is probably up to his armpits in newborn poop (congrats) so wont be on here to give advise..

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Have been trying to adapt in the last week to HFLC. Minimal carbs over last 5 days and getting a bit of weight loss already. Also noting that I don't need to eat as frequently. Was cruising !

Except was in my fast friday bunch ride today. I'm well rested, but I did notice that I felt very weary - like basically had no energy. Got dropped early and felt like I had nothing on the rest of the route. 

Is there a place to load up on a bit of carb before higher intense? e.g a banana  or something? Thoughts?

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1 minute ago, dazmuzza said:

Have been trying to adapt in the last week to HFLC. Minimal carbs over last 5 days and getting a bit of weight loss already. Also noting that I don't need to eat as frequently. Was cruising !

Except was in my fast friday bunch ride today. I'm well rested, but I did notice that I felt very weary - like basically had no energy. Got dropped early and felt like I had nothing on the rest of the route. 

Is there a place to load up on a bit of carb before higher intense? e.g a banana  or something? Thoughts?

My opinion only...

trying to do a "hard ride" when you are making such a dietary change is futile... adaption takes time, and if you keep pulling yourself out of adaption by having carbs then you wont reach adaption... Once you are adapted, then you can become more flexible with switching between fuels and this is when you can add the extra carbs to get through harder session or as recovery...

best time to adapt is after your a race or in off season when you are recovering so your workouts will be easy aerobic efforts as there is some thought that higher intensity workouts hinder things during the adaption process.. anyone expecting to maintain current training plans while adapting is going to experience poor performance and most likely give up..

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9 minutes ago, dazmuzza said:

Thanks pieman.

Thing is, I never stop training! :)

 

Do you a month where you can focus on swimming, easy rides and minimal running (especially for first 2 weeks)...

or do you do intervals year around..

 

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Yeah Tailwind is interesting just simple sugar (Dextrose?) and no Maltodextrin.

I am a few days ahead of you in adapting, end of week 1 was tough but more pep coming back in this week. Weight stabilising after losing 2-3kg of water weight. Aerobic zone running 2h and riding 3-4h hasn't been too bad. Some marathon rp efforts to try this w/e, will not beat myself up if I can't do them yet. I'd wait 2-4 weeks before adding back up to 150g of carbs. Instead have some salt or electrolytes before you exercise and a bullet proof coffee.

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6 hours ago, dazmuzza said:

Thanks pieman.

Thing is, I never stop training! :)

 

Don’t just reset expectations of sessions for 3-4 weeks. It worked for me - leaving ego at home took 1-2 goes though. 

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