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The end of disc brakes??

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Following the accident involving Movistar rider Fran Ventoso at Paris-Roubaix, the UCI will suspend the use of disc brakes in professional road racing amid safety fears

 

 

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/racing/uci-suspends-use-disc-brakes-professional-racing-220931?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Social#KfjOHdBjUQK8J1uG.99

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Handlebars, wheels (and spokes), cranks, chainrings and cassettes also banned amongst safety fears.

 

I think the difference is a brake rotor can be spinning very quickly on impact and is normally exposed. Those other parts are not spinning as quickly and/or are safe in their normal position, spokes are in a rim, rim has a tire on it and is shrouded in a frame, chain rings have a chain on it covering the teeth...

 

Maybe UCI will require a cover for the rotors....

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mmm... Not what I would have expected from a spinning brake rotor. I was expecting a longer gash/cut, that looks like a gouge made by something like a poll or post.

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I'm calling a conspiracy on this one.

 

- Movistar is sponsored by Campagnolo.

- Campag do not have disc brakes in their product range.... yet

- Campag would benefit a lot from the suspension of Disc Brakes.

- If I were Campag i would have the PR agency pushing this story EVERYWHERE to show how dangerous those shimano and sram disc brakes are.

 

Conspiracy.....

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Â

I think the difference is a brake rotor can be spinning very quickly on impact and is normally exposed. Those other parts are not spinning as quickly and/or are safe in their normal position, spokes are in a rim, rim has a tire on it and is shrouded in a frame, chain rings have a chain on it covering the teeth...

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Maybe UCI will require a cover for the rotors....

Ya I was just being facetious

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Ya I was just being facetious

 

Oh...

 

I wasn't sure what the consensus was on the disc brakes. I thought I read a while back that the Pros were not 100% behind it, but I just figured they were being fussy or traditionalists. Will be interesting to see what happens with this considering the amount of money that has already gone into it.

Edited by MountainMan

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They look shit and arent needed unless you are coming down a 10k hill in the rain.

 

That doesnt happen much.

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Exposed disc rotors have no place in mass start road racing. End of.

 

This is exactly what was always going to happen. Two riders suffered injury in the one race after coming into contact with the disc rotors and were carted off in ambulance. Thankfully only 2 teams had them on their bikes.

 

Rotors are fine for many riding situations (i.e. mostly solo stuff), but this sort of racing is most definitely not a suitable application for them.

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We still don't even know if it was caused by the disc brakes. The injury was to Ventoso's left leg. Given that he said it didn't happen in a fall, and given that the discs are on the left-hand-side of the bike, it would have taken some pretty unusual gymnastics to hit the rear disc with your left leg...

 

Form his open letter to the UCI: "I didn't actually fall down: it was just my leg touching the back of his bike. I kept riding on."

 

So yeah, how does your left leg hit the left-hand-side rear disc brake? I'd get it if it was in amongst a big crash with bikes and bodies everywhere, but he said he didn't fall?

 

My suspicion is that the injury came from impact with some other part of the bike...

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Couldn't they just make the rotors have a slightly thicker and rounded edge* on them? Or just make covers* for them?

 

I can't imagine the bike companies just chucking them out.

 

*Patent Pending

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I want to know why anyone needs them on a road bike.

like fascinators at the races...

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re: Why would anyone want one...

 

Where I think the most interesting developments will come out of disc brakes is not the brakes themselves, but what will then happen with the development of rims.

 

Without the need for a brake-track at the rim, I wonder what good designers will be able to come up with in terms of rim design - any shape changes, or maybe just being able to go super-lightweight but maintain strength (without the constraints of the braketrack).

 

Ending up with a wheel that has a relatively light rim-weight (but still strong) would be a very useful outcome from the shift to discs... No idea if/what is possible, but would be great to find out... :-)

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re: Why would anyone want one...

 

Where I think the most interesting developments will come out of disc brakes is not the brakes themselves, but what will then happen with the development of rims.

 

Without the need for a brake-track at the rim, I wonder what good designers will be able to come up with in terms of rim design - any shape changes, or maybe just being able to go super-lightweight but maintain strength (without the constraints of the braketrack).

 

Ending up with a wheel that has a relatively light rim-weight (but still strong) would be a very useful outcome from the shift to discs... No idea if/what is possible, but would be great to find out... :-)

 

This is where I always thought the drive was coming from. It enables the wheel designers to not have to worry about carbon brake track issues and just worry about wheel shape/ weight.

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So yeah, how does your left leg hit the left-hand-side rear disc brake?.

 

Front and rear discs in play though.

Pics I saw of him lying on the ground are odd if he didn't fall.

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I think those pics are of afterwards, when he realized he had an injury? Ventoso says himself when he saw his leg later and realized what had happened, he collapsed on the ground...

 

Also, re: front and rear discs. Both are leftside, so still doesn't explain contact with left leg while not crashing...??

 

I have no doubt Ventoso is convinced it was from the disc. And the conspiracy theories about Canyon trying to discredit discs are laughable. I just wonder if there's been an innocent mistake and the injury was from elsewhere...

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Unless old mate he hit had his bike turned around by a stack?

Footage would be good.

 

Only need to be the front wheel turned around at that.

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Even then I would have thought it would be next to impossible to take that chunk out of old mate's leg and for him to keep riding if a wheel/rotor hit him in the shin.

Then again, I wouldn't have believed Sagan could not stack sitting on Fab's wheel either.

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Even then I would have thought it would be next to impossible to take that chunk out of old mate's leg and for him to keep riding if a wheel/rotor hit him in the shin.

Then again, I wouldn't have believed Sagan could not stack sitting on Fab's wheel either.

Is this what Sagan was supposed to do.

http://www.steephill.tv/players/youtube3/?title=Slomo+footage+of+the+final+corner+crash,+Men%27s+Stage+4&dashboard=redlands-classic&id=GPR68gFdapk&yr=2016

(Last corner of stage 4 in the Redlands Classic in the US)

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Wheels stop spinning pretty quickly in a crash. For those that don't, the cassette (big deadly spiky thing) would be spinning at exactly the same speed as the rotor on the opposite of a rear wheel so I'm guessing the front is a bigger issue.

 

Simple plastic guards ala motorcross would fix the problem completely but possibly interfere with wheel changes.

 

Agree they're probably not "needed" but then neither are most advances.

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Additionally if this story of twister which sounds impossible in its current form is true and has resulted in instant action due to safety concerns..

 

Why no suspension of motorbikes given that you know, someone actually died?

 

Priorities seem a bit messed up to me!

Edited by Esoteric
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Well, it is only a trial for the UCI at present.

They say they decided to halt the trial without any influence from this incident.

But, it is the UCI, so who knows?

 

If you see how some of the bikes twisted in the Redlands crash, it is possible to have the contact needed.

If the wheel ends up at the right angle to slice the leg, the leg keeps coming and the rotor digs in momentarily, then rips out with momentum, it could take a chunk out?

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Wheels stop spinning pretty quickly in a crash. For those that don't, the cassette (big deadly spiky thing) would be spinning at exactly the same speed as the rotor on the opposite of a rear wheel so I'm guessing the front is a bigger issue.

 

Simple plastic guards ala motorcross would fix the problem completely but possibly interfere with wheel changes.

 

Agree they're probably not "needed" but then neither are most advances.

Cassettes don't spin unless you are pedaling.

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What I don't understand about discs on a road bike is that 99%of the time you are guaranteed to be putting too much faith in a tiny contact area. So you'd basically be out braking the tyres all the time which is more of an issue IMO.

 

Discs on MTB, yes. They have wider contact areas.

Discs on Roadies, nup, simple money spinner from bike and wheel companies.

Edited by fitfastfat977

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The whole "Brakes will exceed capacity of tyres!!!!11!!!" is a debunked bit garbage - there is more to the physics of brakes than just contact patch of the tyre. There is the fact the maximum traction actually occurs when there is somewhere around 15% sliding, there is heat radiation, there is ability to modulate and finesse the braking, the ability to handle contaminants that reduce braking power.... the simple truth is that disc brakes allow you to reach and STAY on the threshold of maximum braking performance better than rim brakes, ie in that zone where slippage occurs BUT where maximum traction actually is.

 

And of course good braking technique will also make weight shift happen so guess what happens? More force on the tyre, an altered contact patch that helps resist breaking free. Again, easier to achieve with superior modulation of discs.

 

Oh and about size of tyres - what exactly again is the trend appearing backed by science that disc brakes are allowing much easier on road bikes? That wouldn't be... wider tyres now would it? Oh wait more rubber on the road, that wouldn't also lead to.... *GASP!* better braking performance?????

Disc brakes work better even on the same sized tyre. It's the same argument drum brake proponents tried to use when resisting disc brakes (Yes there are plenty who say drums are better) and it's just as wrong as it ignores the fundamentals of how brakes and tyres work. The low education view that a tyre and brakes are simple systems that can only give you X under any circumstance has never been backed by the realization that braking systems are in fact highly complex sets of interactions where two braking systems, even with the same tyre most certainly can and DO produce different stopping distances.

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As we've been using disc brakes for decades already in mountain biking, how many serious injuries have occurred due to the disc rotor?

It'd be a real shame if the UCI through it's rulemaking in the pro arena, then the market following, hindered or stopped the development of disc brakes on road bikes.

 

2 decades ago, Airbags or ABS on my car? I'm a great driver, why would I need that.... and now I won't do any long trip in a vehicle without it.

half a decade ago, I had a look at the new Di2 electric shifting and for the life of me, couldn't see the value...... and now I have it on the P3

a couple of years ago, ( as a former cabbie ) I thought Uber was total rubbish, and now I'm an Uber driver on weekends

Disc brakes on a road bike? Today I don't need it, but on my next roadie..... most likely

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As we've been using disc brakes for decades already in mountain biking, how many serious injuries have occurred due to the disc rotor?

It'd be a real shame if the UCI through it's rulemaking in the pro arena, then the market following, hindered or stopped the development of disc brakes on road bikes.

 

But the MTB'ers don't ride in large bunches and fall over each other in a big pile up on a regular basis.

 

What about my fully patented, thickened, rounded edge on the rotors idea? That will just fix everything.

 

If anyone from Shimano, or Sram is reading this, message me, we can discus licensing fees and royalties.

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Cranks still have to be turning to spin the cassette.

Yes I realise that and most cranks don't just sit stationary whilst a bike cartwheels through the air.

 

People are acting like discs are akin to a circular saw.

 

Whatever, doesn't affect me at all but there's a lot of fear dur to irrationality like the Rowe comment ^

 

Disc brakes aren't all about braking harder, they modulate better, less affected by weather and don't cause carbon rims to explode.. kinda thought he'd know that ð

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What about my fully patented, thickened, rounded edge on the rotors idea? That will just fix everything.

 

 

 

How would the brake pads work??

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As we've been using disc brakes for decades already in mountain biking, how many serious injuries have occurred due to the disc rotor?

 

MTB, by and large, does not involve large groups of riders in very close proximity for long periods. MTB crashes tend to be solo in nature.

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How would the brake pads work??

the pads don't contact the very edge of the disc, only the face.

 

actually Mountain Man, why the 'ell don't they round off the edge of the disc...

I'll hit the edge of the mountain bike disc a file on the weekend.

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the pads don't contact the very edge of the disc, only the face.

 

 

Yeah but from what Ive seen teh pads dont move very far.

 

So for the pads to clear a thickened edge they will not have enough throw to contact the disc face.

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As we've been using disc brakes for decades already in mountain biking, how many serious injuries have occurred due to the disc rotor?

 

Looks like one the other week in NZ. Start watching from 22:20

 

 

Sliced arm on disc rotor.

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Yeah but from what Ive seen teh pads dont move very far.

 

So for the pads to clear a thickened edge they will not have enough throw to contact the disc face.

 

But the calipers can be designed to accommodate the thinker edge just at the top, along with a small leaver to open them up while installing and removing the wheel, like on normal road brakes have so you can get the tire past them.

 

The new improved MountainMan Road Rotors are the perfect solution... Still waiting a call from Shimano or Sram, c'mon people who will get the jump on the others?

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actually Mountain Man, why the 'ell don't they round off the edge of the disc...

 

Damned if i know, seems simple enough to me. They could even build them with a couple of millimeters of soft(ish) silicone or rubber on the edge*.

 

*Patent... Bah, whatever.

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Yes I realise that and most cranks don't just sit stationary whilst a bike cartwheels through the air.

People are acting like discs are akin to a circular saw.

Whatever, doesn't affect me at all but there's a lot of fear dur to irrationality like the Rowe comment ^

Disc brakes aren't all about braking harder, they modulate better, less affected by weather and don't cause carbon rims to explode.. kinda thought he'd know that ð

Yep, true. Id rather have my leg encounter a spinning disc than a stationary chainring, especially if the chains on the small ring. Been done by one of those before (my own in a stack) and it wasnt pretty

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While the UCI are at it they should ban side-pull brakes 'coz that arm sticks out plus the cable ends can be sharp.

 

Call yourselves pro's? toughen up and go back to single speed fixies! :shock:

 

Seriously, I have discs on three of my current machines and they cause me no grief whatsoever (two hydraulic, one cable) - all work very well and require very little maintenance.

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I was abducted by a disc. There was a bright light and then I was sucked up into it.

 

They probed me while I was inside and now I am pregnant with an alien's baby (or just fat).

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I was abducted by a disc. There was a bright light and then I was sucked up into it.

 

They probed me while I was inside and now I am pregnant with an alien's baby (or just fat).

Did it go woosh woosh, or was it a fake dish?

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