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We'll have to just disagree then. If you want to play on the road, with all the associated rules and obligations, I have no problem with carrying ID. Nor with being licenced for that matter. It should be road user based, not vehicle type.

 

OK, well that rules out riders between 12 and 17 from riding their bikes. It would be illegal for them to ride on either road or footpath.

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We'll have to just disagree then. If you want to play on the road, with all the associated rules and obligations, I have no problem with carrying ID. Nor with being licenced for that matter. It should be road user based, not vehicle type.

 

I've no problem with carrying ID. It's a prudent thing to do for emergency reasons. But being legally forced to carry and produce state issued photo ID just so you can ride your bike is another matter entirely.

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Tell me how making carrying of state issued photo ID (real or virtual) mandatory:

- improves cyclist's safety?

- encourages cycling participation?

 

Are drivers suddenly going to drive more thoughtfully and with due care and attention because I have a mandatory state issued photo ID in my back pocket?

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It's not about prudent carrying of ID for emergencies (that can be anything and a personal choice).

It's the *mandatory requirement under law* to carry and produce official photo ID (i.e. a passport, a driver's licence or an official government photo ID card) to conduct activity for which no licence is required. It's an erosion of civil liberties.

 

 

Drivers need to be able to produce their licence to show that they are indeed licenced drivers. Cyclists don't need a licence, so why should they carry one?

 

If its about 'keeping people accountable', then you'd agree that EVERYONE should always carry ID and produce it on demand. What if someone jaywalks across a street? What if someone accidently stands on the grass in a city park? What if someone just kinda looks dodgy?

 

 

 

From the QLD Gov website.

 

Police rights

Police have the right to ask for your name and address in many situations, including when they:

  • find you committing an offence
  • ‘reasonably suspect’ that you have committed an offence
  • think you can help them investigate an indictable offence or domestic violence act
  • give you an order to stop making noise or being a nuisance
  • stop you while you are in control of a vehicle
  • trying to enforce another specific law
  • where it is reasonable in the circumstances.

Although police can ask you to give your name and address, they must warn you that it’s an offence to refuse to do so.

If you refuse to give your name and address when police have a right to ask for it, and you have no reasonable excuse for refusing, you’ll be committing an offence and could be charged.

Giving a false name or someone else’s name could result in more serious charges.

 

 

That seems pretty straight forward and in QLD at least carrying ID is not new but perhaps not well known.

 

In NSW, I found this info

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/leara2002451/

refer Part 3, division 2, 14 through 19

The wording used is all "Identity" not licence.

 

So if this document is to be followed then basically the requirement for Identity for a driver or passenger of a vehicle (they don't state what type and a bicycle is a legal vehicle so you could assume it is included) the power of request etc. is already in place anyway. All they have done by saying we must carry photo ID is made us more aware of the requirement that is already in place anyway.

 

I'd like to hear a take on this from a current or former Police Officer in NSW or other states.

How does it really work in the real world?

 

So if the Police had reason to stop you and request ID eg:you run a red light then it would seem they have just rights to ask for your ID. As that would meet the criteria.

 

As it stands at the moment if you run a red and caught, what happens if you refuse to give any ID after you commit the offense?

 

 

It really doesn't sound like cyclist are being made to do something that is new nor something that other members of the community don't have to do should there be reason for ID request.

Edited by TrevS

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If you're a cyclist and dont carry ID with you on rides, you're just a moron, plain and simple. Give me a call to book into the room full of mirrors for a good long hard look at yourself..

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Carrying ID and providing your ID are two different things both in reality and legally.

 

Gay is basically introducing an Australia card for cyclists. The people, the Australian people, condemned this in 1984 and rejected it at the ballot box.

 

If they are fair dinkum, they'll introduce mandatory photo ID for walkers as well and those old farkers on their scooters and the disabled in their wheelchairs.

 

Personally, I couldn't care less, I'm not about to start carrying my wallet when I go for a bike ride and that's where my drivers licence lives.

 

I ride with ID and will continue to do so.

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Every other vehicle on the road has a means of identification of the owner, if not the driver, so why not a bicycle? We don't have to stay a metre from cars as we overtake them on the left, so they can just as rightly be indignant about the laws.

 

Watch out when you go to the country Alex. You'll have to check up on the rules regarding horses. Did you know you are legally required to slow down and stop if a rider is anywhere on the road reserve and signals you to? That includes a B-Double if they want to try to enforce their right.

 

Does it actually specify that it has to be a Govt issued ID?

do horse drivers require ID

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And the sooner the nsw govt brings in a virtual licence that links your drivers licence, fishing licence, gun licence etc the better.

 

Don't know what happens once smart phones are obsolete though, maybe a chip under the skin like dogs get now ?

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And the sooner the nsw govt brings in a virtual licence that links your drivers licence, fishing licence, gun licence etc the better.

 

Don't know what happens once smart phones are obsolete though, maybe a chip under the skin like dogs get now ?

They'll just link it everyone's Sportsbet account. The kids will all get them in year 7 by then.

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Don't know what happens once smart phones are obsolete though, maybe a chip under the skin like dogs get now ?

I'll be first in line, I hate carrying stuff.

 

You wouldn't even need to fill in the back of your bib at races.

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I'll be first in line, I hate carrying stuff.

You wouldn't even need to fill in the back of your bib at races.

Start line, every sensor in between and finish line....no more things around the ankle,it just picks you up.

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I always carry my old licence with me when I go riding. It's more likely to be used if I'm out riding by myself and I have an accident than getting pulled over by the cops. I'm not about to breaking road rules and I have no issues giving my information to Police if requested anyway.

 

No-one is about to start badgering law abiding cyclists - emergency services waste unnecessary time trying to identify people who are out by themselves and have no ID on them. Just recently a gentleman who was out running had a heart attack on the riverloop in inner city Brisbane. For over 12 hours they couldn't identify who he was or notify his next of kin.

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They'll just link it everyone's Sportsbet account. The kids will all get them in year 7 by then.

Lol....when my son was littler than he is now, I'm at shark park and Inglis goes in for the Melbourne Storm. I'm not happy at all, he looks up and goes something like, it's ok,dad, we got first try scorer. I go like "huh", he goes I went into your tab account and put the bet on. I ask him how much, he says one dollar. I don't know wether to kill him for doing it or for only putting a dollar on...lol

 

He was 9, just looked up the game

Edited by Oompa Loompa

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I always carry my old licence with me when I go riding. It's more likely to be used if I'm out riding by myself and I have an accident than getting pulled over by the cops. I'm not about to breaking road rules and I have no issues giving my information to Police if requested anyway.

 

No-one is about to start badgering law abiding cyclists - emergency services waste unnecessary time trying to identify people who are out by themselves and have no ID on them. Just recently a gentleman who was out running had a heart attack on the riverloop in inner city Brisbane. For over 12 hours they couldn't identify who he was or notify his next of kin.

 

You need t read Billy's bushies heart attack newsletter, it makes you cry

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I don't have a particular issue with carrying ID as long as it can be a copy of your license or whatever. I have a mate who cycles so he doesn't need a car (and subsequently has no license) and I think in that circumstance an ID should be free if required.

 

I'm not so sure there won't be instances of people being stopped 'just to check' though. There will be a percentage of cyclist hating police who'll just love the chance to issue a big fine for non-compliance. It'll happen.

 

Frankly, I'd be happier if they just introduced licensing for over 18s. Do it through the state bike association so it's linked to your 3rd party insurance and just shove the card in your spares bag and never worry about it again.

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yup you do

William Philip HickJan 4, 2009

SPECIAL WEEK ONE, 2009 BUNDEENA REPORT

 

Preamble: In about thirty-five years of running, the Bushies have never had to call an ambulance during or after a run. Fair enough, we did have the police dog squad at Garrawarra once, with the PolAir rescue chopper on its way. They weren’t required though, as when Bob the Banker, Lorraine and Clare finally staggered out of the Catchment area after seven and a half hours of bush-bashing, they didn’t require medical assistance (well, not much anyway).

Unfortunately, our perfect record was ruined on Saturday by two thoughtless, inconsiderate, attention-seeking Bushies who decided to collapse after the run, thereby interrupting and nearly ruining everyone’s morning tea.

The culprits: First off, Fat Wayne thought he would give his heart a rest and save it the trouble of pumping blood up to his brain, and then Boots decided he wanted some of the attention so he gave his heart a rest by stopping it altogether.

9.10am: Hicky had not long finished the run and was walking back to his car when there was a sudden shout from Pussy to come over and grab Fat Wayne as he was passing out. Pussy, Hicky and Fat Phil sat him down on the Armco railing, holding him upright as they knew that if he fell over the back of the railing it would take at least a forklift to retrieve his body. After a couple of minutes of incoherent, unintelligible babbling (similar to what Billy does most of the time), he came around, only to collapse again a few minutes later. Hicky called out to Wayne Tibbitts to come over and help. Now some thought that this was because Wayne works at Sutherland Hospital . This was not entirely correct. It was also because Wayne and Pussy were the only two Bushies big enough to hold Fat Wayne upright.

9.15am: Wayne regained consciousness again just as an ambulance drove up the street. Hicky quickly jumped out and waved it down, thinking that that was an incredibly quick response time (especially as nobody had actually rung an ambulance). The bloke started to check out Wayne, who by this time had more or less returned to the same world as the rest of us (well, most of us). He also kept an eye on Fat Phil, but we insisted that he was OK – he always looked like that.

9.18am: Lovey’s voice is heard in the distance calling out: “Hicky! Hicky! He should be up here” pointing towards the RSL club. “Someone’s had a heart attack.” The ambulance officer glares at Hicky and say’s, “Wasn’t it you that called us?” Hicky sheepishly replied, “Well, technically no, but as you were passing by I thought you might look at Fat Wayne first.” This didn’t go down well at all, and the ambulance officer said that he would call the fire brigade to look after Fat Wayne (for a while the logic of that was lost on us) while he continued up the hill to his original callout victim. We still thought that a Bushie was more important than some drunk from the local RSL whose heart had given a bit of a flutter.

9.24am: The fire brigade dutifully arrived and the blokes began taking Fat Wayne’s blood pressure. I’m not sure how the two numbers are interpreted, but even added together they barely made triple figures. Everyone but Fat Wayne (who was by now back in La La land) knew that this wasn’t good. The fireys thought that maybe they should give him some oxygen. Unbeknown to them, Fat Wayne is an instructor with NSW Fire Brigades. After a few minutes of fumbling, Wayne , who was once again more or less conscious, grabbed the equipment, set it up and administered the oxygen to himself. While this was happening, another ambulance went past. Then a third ambulance drove up the hill. We couldn’t understand all this trouble just for some RSL drunk who felt a bit crook (this was an unfortunate assumption on our part).

9.35am: Meanwhile, Fat Wayne was trying to convince the fireys that he was fine to drive home and that he wouldn’t be a danger on the road. Thankfully, one of the three ambulances arrived to see how Wayne was getting on. After a lot of serious talking, he was eventually coaxed into the ambulance and quickly strapped down (in case he tried to escape).

Meanwhile, up the hill, the heart attack patient turned out not to be a local drunk, but one of our own, Boots the walker.

Boots’ story: Apparently, Boots finished the walk, sat down and his heart decided that now would be a good time to skip a few beats – actually, quite a lot of beats: in fact, nearly all of them. The walkers had laid him down and immediately called an ambulance. The good news was that there was an ambulance nearby. The bad news was that a few minutes later, Hicky waved the ambulance down to tend to Fat Wayne (who turned out to just be overweight, unfit and dehydrated).

Fortunately, despite the fiasco occurring all around him, Boots survived and we don’t have to run Super Mt. next week.

About 10.00am: The three ambulances and the fire truck depart Bundeena Wharf; The Bushies in the coffee shop at the top of the town were still waiting for their cappuccinos; and the locals in the main street were mumbling that those bloody runners were not welcome back in Bundeena ever again.

The aftermath: The good news from the morning is that both Fat Wayne and Boots (Gary) will survive to come back to future Saturday Bushie runs – maybe not next week though. Fat Wayne was released into the care of Pussy and Shoulders on Saturday afternoon, but Boots will have to spend a bit more time in hospital while the specialists determine what went wrong. As a point of interest, Boots is a regular at Sutherland Hospital (this being his fourth heart attack or heart-related episode) and was even asked at Admissions if he wanted his usual room.

Things always come in threes: Later on, when Hicky and Six Bricks arrived at Casualty to check on Fat Wayne and Boots, they were met by champion cyclist (and honorary Bushie) Mark Nicholls and his wife just leaving the Emergency Dept. Without a shadow of doubt, Mark’s face had seen better days – and not just because he’s a really old bugger.

Apparently, about the same time as Boots and Fat Wayne were trying to get our attention at Bundeena, Mark was heading north on his bike, sprinting downhill into Waterfall. Unfortunately, Mark’s front wheel decided to part company with the rest of his bike, resulting in him kissing the asphalt at 6okph. While he was lying in the back of his ambulance he heard the urgent calls coming through on the radio for more ambulances to be sent to Bundeena for some sort of emergency.

The future: All in all, it was an interesting start to the year. When you consider that this was only week one of 2009, you have to wonder what the rest of the year will bring. Hopefully, it will improve a hell of a lot.

As a very anxious, caring and concerned Sharon said as she waited impatiently for her cappuccino at Bundeena:

“Ah s..t! We’re not going to have to run up Super Mountain again are we?”

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Apols for off topic but it's about as relevant and this is gold

 

Part 1

-----

 

 

G'day Bushies,

 

This report is pretty long so I have broken it into two emails. I'll send part two shortly.

 

Hicky

 

Bushies Heathcote Adventure Report: Saturday 26 November 2011

 

It is difficult to know exactly where to begin this report. Saturdays run had everything: flooded creeks; raging torrents, deadly causeways; artillery shells (true); manic swims; hopelessly lost runners; very worried families; police and the Polair helicopter. Perhaps the best place to start would be with the Bushies who scouted out the course during the preceding week.

 

Preparation: Rapids checked out some of the proposed course on Tuesday, however, he still managed to get lost on Saturday (more on that later). Crack and the Garden Gnome (Brian Pee) parked just past the Heathcote industrial estate at 6.45am on Thursday and headed down Eckersley Road (its really Mirang Road, but weve called it Eckersley for so long that few would know its correct name anyway) until they reached the pipeline. They then headed west along the pipeline and down the track to lake Eckersley. Instead of swimming across the lake, Crack took Brian way, way down stream before crossing the river. That meant that instead of bush-bashing up to the old Eckersley Ridge Road, he was actually in the next valley which meant that he was heading west towards Campbelltown. Eventually, Brian convinced Crack to head down to a creek that he could see, and much to their surprise, they were in exactly the same spot as they had been two hours previously. Just under three hours after they had set out, they arrived back at the car, exhausted and none the wiser about where they should go on Saturday. This disaster was a portent for what would happen in two days time.

 

The plan: Because of his Thursday disaster, Billy sacked Crack from the WannaBe ranger duties and just told him to follow Rapids and the Goodies. The plan was to go from Heathcote Pub, down Forum Dive to the pipeline, past the Lake Eckersley turn until they reached the old Eckersley Ridge road (opposite the steps over the pipeline). Rapids was to take them across the river, up the old road until they came to the sharp bend, down through the scrub to Eckersley Lake, swim across and then run back up to the pipe line. Go! would be called on the pipeline somewhere near Eckersley (Mirang) Road. Pretty much a foolproof plan.

 

The first hour: The run began about 6.50am in torrential rain, rain which had been falling steadily for the previous 24-hours. Everything went according to plan until they reached Battery Causeway, where Heathcote Creek meets the pipeline. The causeway was flooded and the water level was at knee height, or for Brian Pee and Paul N, genital height. The Leprechaun was prepared to turn back with Pommy Trish and Six Bricks, but Six Bricks said, Dont be a wimp! Go with the rest of them. Youll be OK. Trust me. The Leprechaun was to regret this decision for the next five hours. The two groups crossed the creek, not giving any thought to the rain still falling or the amount of water that must be coming down Heathcote Creek from all the rain over the past 24-hours.

This lack of foresight was particularly surprising from someone whose nickname is Rapids, and who got this nickname from being washed over a flooded causeway, quite possibly, this causeway.

They reached the old Eckersley Road turn, went down across the river and up the old road. This was the scene of the first mistake. Rapids missed the cairn of rocks at the sharp bent and continued up the road. Now I dont want to give away the exact location where Rapids found himself, but suffice to say that there numerous loud explosions that seemed to be getting closer with every minute they continued running uphill. Eventually, someone said, Whats that strange smell? Cordite came the reply. It was at that stage that Rapids figured that it would be a good time to turn around and head very quickly back down the hill.

On the way back down he found the cairn of rocks and turned off the road and down to lake Eckersley. Now two of the WannaBe runners are renowned for their complete lack of swimming prowess. Showing incredible foresight, someone (I think Marky Mark) had brought along two one-metre long noodles (those long, round foam things) to help these two blokes to float across the lake. They worked a treat and they both made is safely to the other side. The Accountant wasnt so fortunate, losing his watch about two strokes from shore, never to be seen again. After making their way back up to the pipeline, everyone headed back until they again reached Battery Causeway.

 

Battery causeway: The water had risen (surprise, surprise) to chest height and was completely impassable. Leonie and Linda Mc (both excellent swimmers) suggested that they head one hundred metres upstream and just swim across. Their plan was that as the water swept them downstream, they would swim hard from the western bank, ferry gliding (thats a kayaking term for those who dont know) across the water and finishing up on the eastern bank just before the raging torrent could sweep them over the causeway and on to certain death. The girls thought it was a great plan without any obvious flaws. Others werent quite as optimistic as the girls and the Leprechaun said something along the lines of, YOUR FOOKING KIDDING! It was at this stage the group split into two. Rapids and most of the group swam across and headed back along the pipeline, whilst Crack lead five other WannaBes south up the Goanna Track (its really the Bullawarring Track, but we have called it the Goanna Track for the last thirty years) towards Waterfall.

 

The next four-and-a-half hours: For some reason, Crack thought that they would be able to cross Heathcote Creek at the base of the Red Brick Road. Needless to say, that crossing point was far worse even than at the causeway. They made their way back up to the Goanna Track and continued south. Now you would think that at this stage, six people, knowing that Heathcote creek was on their left, the highway was on their left, the power lines were on their left, and that Waterfall was at the end of the track, could not possibly get lost. You would be wrong! Very, very wrong.

They continued south until the track came to a section that crossed a creek coming in on their right (from the west). Now just past this creek is Myuna Pool and on the eastern side is the Mooray Track which heads out to the highway near Hanrob Kennels. All our intrepid bunch had to do was to head west up the creek until they could cross over it, head back east back down the other side until they regained the Goanna Track and then continue on their way. At best they would be able to cross Heathcote Creek at Myuna Pool and head up the Mooray Track, or at worst, they would continue along the Goanna Track until they could cross at either Yellow Pool or just west of the scout camp. At the very worst they would come out on the Old Princes Highway at Cawley Road.

Unfortunately, they chose none of those options. When they headed west up the side creek, they crossed over and then headed south. Yes, thats right. South! They were heading towards Mt. Morella, a mountain a little north of Coatseys famous Mt. Westmacott. At some stage, Jim seemed to have a directional revelation and raised both arms and said, The highways over there. Thats where we should be heading. As Crack had absolutely no idea where he was, as did everyone else, they blindly followed Jims directions. Eventually they reached the top of Mt. Morella from the north eastern side, heading south west, towards Garrawarra and the Woronora Dam Road.

Before they could continue towards Garrawarra, Brian looked in the opposite direction and could see powerlines and just a glimpse of the highway. After nearly five hours, they finally had something they recognised and could head towards.

 

The penultimate challenge: They made their way down hill until they came to the Goanna Track and eventually the crossing at Yellow Pool. All they had to do was cross the creek. Having almost lost Brian at the previous creek, this time Crack held his hand. Halfway across, Brian lost his footing and started heading downstream, being held only by Cracks tenuous grip on his wrist. Marky stepped up and grabbed one of Brians ankles. They now had Brian laying horizontal on his stomach in the raging stream, head under water and being held by one wrist and one ankle. This had all the hallmarks of a disaster. Somehow, Brian reached the eastern shore, having swallowed copious amounts of water, but still alive.

Brians predicament had filled Paul N and the Leprechaun dread. They clung to their noodles with a death-like grip and had to be practically dragged into the creek. However, they made it across safely.

The six WannaBes now started up the hill towards Lyndals street at waterfall. By now, there were many concerned Bushies back at Heathcote, and as Max and Pinky had planned to run at Waterfall anyway, they had headed down towards Yellow Pool, hoping to come across the group at some stage, or at worst, their bodies. When Jim saw Max coming towards him, he raced ahead and gave him a huge hug. Max had to fight him off to prevent getting swamped in kisses.

 

The final stretch: The six WannaBes made their way out to the highway where their group cohesion fell into tatters. Jim set off by himself, followed by the Leprechaun, still tightly hugging his noodle to his chest. Crack, Marky Mark and the Garden Gnome followed, with Paul N and his pink noodle bringing up the rear. Jim arrived back after five-and-a-half hours. The Leprechaun was five minutes behind, followed by the next three a further five minutes back. Paul N and his noodle brought up the rear at a total elapsed time of five hours and forty-five minutes. All the Leprechaun could say when he staggered in was, Fook! Fook! Fook! Which is Gaelic for well, Im sure you can work it out. Paul N on the other hand was unable to utter a word.

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Part 2

 

-----

 

2168Saturday's report - Part two

William Philip HickNov 27, 2011

Now, to step back a bit in time: Normally, after three hours some of us would be a bit worried. However, when Sharon called into Heathcote McDonalds with the newsletter that Billy had given her and the places for the WannaBes were filled in, we just figured Crack had had yet another ridiculously long run and would be at Maccas shortly. Billys hand written newsletter showed that Crack was first, followed by Marky Mark and so on. A little while later Phil Dart arrived at coffee and casually mentioned that the WannaBes still hadnt returned. We told him that they had and that Billy had the places written down. After a brief discussion we realised that they werent in, and in fact, they were missing.

What Billy had done was to ask someone which WannaBes were still out there and then just wrote their names down in the order that he thought they would finish when they eventually arrived. He then gave the completed newsletter to Sharon and went home.

 

The initial search: Hicky left Maccas and drove straight out to Waterfall, but there were no runners to be seen. He drove back to the pub and found only Big Boy, Rapids, Simon and Leonie still there. Big Boy had driven his car to the run and had brought Crack, the Garden Gnome and Marky Mark with him, so he couldnt leave. Hicky drove out to Waterfall again, but still no runners. By now, Simon and Leonie had to leave. Hicky returned to Maccas to break the news, but apart from a few Ohs and Ahs, there didnt seem to be much concern for the welfare of Crack and his cohorts. Hicky again drove out to Waterfall, this time with Six Bricks and he even went as far out as Cawley Road, but once again, no runners.

By now we were getting worried. It was getting up towards five hours and we had six runners lost in a section of Heathcote National Park, rife with flooded creeks and being led by a runner whos quite capable of getting lost in his own driveway.

Coincidentally, a police van was set up on the highway in front of the little park opposite the pub in Veno Street. The two officers manning the van were checking on busloads of young people heading to a Sydney music festival who would stop at the park to use the toilets. Some of the blokes would just run behind the nearby shops and pee against the nearest bush. After twenty or so buses, this was going to cause a problem, so the police were there to make sure everyone behaved themselves. Anyway, I digress.

Phil Dart said that he would take one last drive out to the Woronora Dam Road and Hicky decided that it was time to warn the police that we had a potential problem. He briefed the police, but said he would come back when Phil returned to make a formal missing persons statement. Max and Pinky had arrived by now and headed off to have a run at Waterfall in the general area where we thought they might be. Dogman arrived and informed us that he too had just been to Waterfall and there was no sign of the missing runners. Hicky took Six Bricks back to Maccas so that she could phone Mrs. Leprechaun and break the news that her husband was lost.

 

The police: Phil Dart arrived back empty handed, so Hicky decided that it was time to make a formal report. The female officer had a laminated topographical map so Hicky showed her exactly where the Polair helicopter should look for the six runners, or search for bodies. He also offered to go up in the helicopter (why waste a great opportunity to get a free helicopter ride). Then the male officer got out his notebook and started asking details. This was the point where it got a bit tricky. The conversation went something like this:

 

Officer: How many runners are lost?

Hicky: Six

Officer: What were they wearing?

Hicky: Theyre runners. Theyre wearing running gear.

Officer: What kind of running gear?

Hicky Wet running gear.

Officer: Do you know the colours?

Hicky: No. But theyll probably be the only runners standing in the scrub, frantically waving at the helicopters and planes.

Officer: OK, can you give me names and descriptions of the missing runners?

Hicky: (With much trepidation). OK. Theres Jim, Des and Don, but thats actually one bloke, not three.

Officer: Whats he look like?

Hicky: Well, hes fiftyish, he has a pale complexion (that could be an understatement) and a few weeks ago on one of our runs he nearly died and spent four days in hospital. (all true). Hes also wearing black tights and looks a real dork in them.

Officer: What about the others?

Hicky: Theres the Garden Gnome, actually, Brian Pee.

Officer: Is that his real name?

Hicky: No. Its Pepper. Hes got a prostate problem and hes always peeing, hence the nickname. This wet weather wont be doing that complaint much good.

Officer: Whats he look like?

Hicky: Hes a bit over a metre tall, weighs about 35 kilograms and looks like a seventy-year-old garden gnome.

Officer: And the others?

Hicky: The bloke responsible for all this is Crack. Hes in his early forties but dont worry about his details. We would be really appreciative if you didnt find him.

Officer: Seriously, how will we recognise him?

Hicky: Thats easy. Hell be the one talking crap.

Hicky: Then theres Marky Mark. Mid forties and hes a hunter. I wont tell you any more about him because the Royal National park probably has him on their most wanted list. If the helicopter pilot sees an oil slick in one of the creeks, theres a fair chance its coconut oil and Marky Mark will be under it.

Hicky: Theres the Leprechaun. Dave something. Probably early forties. I think hes an illegal immigrant. If hes still alive, hell be waving a pink noodle at the helicopter and mouthing, FOOK!, FOOK!, FOOK!

Hicky: Lastly, theres Paul N. Hes mid forties, wearing swimming goggles and last seen with a pink noodle down his shorts.

Officer: Whats he look like?

Hicky: Viet Cong.

 

By now the officer had had enough. He closed his notebook and said that he would contact Polair and they would begin a search.

We exchanged telephone numbers so that we could let him know if the six missing runners eventually showed up.

The two police officers left and Hicky wandered back to the others. Not long after this, Big Roy arrived. He had been contacted by Mrs Leprechaun in a very agitated state to ask if he knew where her husband was, which he obviously didnt. Roy decided that he would drive to Waterfall for one last search so he could at least tell Mrs Leprechaun that he had made an attempt to find her husband.

 

The return: Just as Roy started to drive off, Jim (or Don or Des) arrived, looking absolutely shot. A quick discussion followed and it was ascertained that the others were somewhere behind him. Rapids quickly called the police to cancel the Polair search and Roy rang Mrs leprechaun.

A couple of minutes later the Leprechaun arrived. He was not a happy chappie and was so fatigued that he could barely raise his noodle, but he was nevertheless relieved to be back.

Five minutes later Crack, Brian and Marky Mark arrived. We could hear Cracks excuses beginning fifty metres away, but it was all wasted on those present. Marky Mark was OK, but Brian Pee looked like an eighty-year-old, rather than a seventy-year-old. Mind you, he never looks much chop at the best of times.

Hicky started walking past the shops on the highway to give Paul N some company on the home stretch (especially important as all his mates had abandoned him).

There he was, near the Charcoal Chicken shop, wandering along with his pink noodle firmly grasped in hand. He had survived. He staggered back to the pub at 12.35pm. Five hours and forty-five minutes after he had set off. Until now, there have been very few Bushies who have cracked the five-hour barrier. The legendry Garrawarra trio (Clair, Bob the Banker Big Red) had the police dog squad, but no helicopter. Then there was Big Helen on the Dead Cow Track, JB on Waterfall Hill and Hooray on his second ever Bushie run at Helensburgh. Six WannaBes today joined that illustrious group.

 

Wrap Up: A number of things were learned from Saturdays run. However, rather than elaborate, lets just remember one really important message from this experience. That is, dont ever, ever, ever go on a run where any of those six blokes are ranger.

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All I can say is that if it has half the effect it did on riding in Brisbane when they introduced the laws here, you'll end up glad they did it. Cars veer away from you instead of towards you, and because most people have no idea how far 1m is, you generally get 2.

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Was sitting at a cafe in Wahroonga a few months ago watching cyclists weaving around cars at the round-a-about near the railway crossing just fascinated by the suicidal nature of it all.

If you're there again, drop me a note. That roundabout is a nightmare on the bike, motorbike or car. Part of it is the large amount of senior drivers who go through Wahroonga and the other is the blind spot you have approaching it through the town - there's a blind spot seeing cars from the right thanks to a big tree!

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The fines are total BS, this is a case of second third class road users getting first class fines.

 

Same goes for the ID, unless pedestrians also need to carry ID why should cyclists? I see pedestrians walking and running on public roads all the time, heaps of them run red lights too. If cyclists were actually treated like legitimate road users by fellow motorists and police then there may be a valid argument for these new rules and fines. But they are not treated like that at all.

 

Is there any actual evidence to support the introduction of these new laws? None of the articles I have read point out data or studies that indicate these changes may have a positive impact on road users. Yep, total BS.

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If you're a cyclist and dont carry ID with you on rides, you're just a moron, plain and simple.

 

Why?

 

Will the paramedics not put you in an ambulance or the medical staff at the emergency room not treat you if you don't have ID? Will passers by ignore your body on the side of the road if they can't find any ID on it? Seriously, unless you have an existing medical condition or allergy that may effect your treatment(in which case shouldn't you have some kind of medical bracelet?) what is the ID for?

 

You don't think the Police can identify you with out a wrist band with your name on it? If you have been unable to provide your name for an extended period of time due to injuries it is likely that by the time you are in a stable condition anyone that is missing you might have already contacted the police who in turn would connect the unconscious cyclist with the missing cyclist, one would think.

 

I can understand people wanting their loved ones to know if they are unconscious after an accident but emotions aside I don't see it being particularly important in an emergency for most people.

 

Though maybe I am just trying to justify the fact I don't bother carrying ID while cycling so I don't feel bad about YoYo calling me a moron...

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Other than the ID issue, what is everyone's beef with the laws? They bring bikes into line with other vehicles, which is what everyone keeps screaming about. It gives motorists the hint that they need to give us more room (and it really has worked in the states it's already been introduced).

 

I can't honestly understand how people can stand up one week and shout that cyclists are legitimate road users and have the same rights on the road as cars, and then this week complain that they should continue to pay 1/7 of the fine that any other road user does for breaking the rules.

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Other than the ID issue, what is everyone's beef with the laws? They bring bikes into line with other vehicles, which is what everyone keeps screaming about. It gives motorists the hint that they need to give us more room (and it really has worked in the states it's already been introduced).

 

I have no beef with them at all, although I can see why people think the vehicle fines aren't quite equivalent. I don't even have a particular issue with the ID as long as it can be a copy.

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I passed a dude riding a bike with a colander on his head last weekend. Now THAT's freedom.

I've seen that dude. Unless there's more than one.

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From the QLD Gov website.

 

 

That seems pretty straight forward and in QLD at least carrying ID is not new but perhaps not well known.

 

In NSW, I found this info

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/leara2002451/

refer Part 3, division 2, 14 through 19

The wording used is all "Identity" not licence.

 

So if this document is to be followed then basically the requirement for Identity for a driver or passenger of a vehicle (they don't state what type and a bicycle is a legal vehicle so you could assume it is included) the power of request etc. is already in place anyway. All they have done by saying we must carry photo ID is made us more aware of the requirement that is already in place anyway.

 

I'd like to hear a take on this from a current or former Police Officer in NSW or other states.

How does it really work in the real world?

 

So if the Police had reason to stop you and request ID eg:you run a red light then it would seem they have just rights to ask for your ID. As that would meet the criteria.

 

As it stands at the moment if you run a red and caught, what happens if you refuse to give any ID after you commit the offense?

 

 

It really doesn't sound like cyclist are being made to do something that is new nor something that other members of the community don't have to do should there be reason for ID request.

 

Qld Police are entitled to get your name and address under a number of situations (mostly around committing or reasonably suspected of committing an offence). However you are mistaking that with compulsory carrying and production of ID.

 

You just tell them. You don't have to produce anything, and certainly noty compelled to carry any.

 

I ALWAYS carry ID when I'm riding in case anything happens to me. But that doesn't mean it should be compulsory...

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Was he straining up the hills?

 

Boom tish.

 

I've seen that dude. Unless there's more than one.

Dunno but he looked in his 30s, had a decent head of blondish hair poking out from under it. About a minute later I got charged by a duck. Came straight at me from the grass to the side of the path near the Regatta Hotel.

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So have I got this right, I have to carry photo ID in any triathlon or cycles race in NSW. someone get that gay fellow here.

The same as you have to have a working bell or horn on your bike. Can't remember the TO's ever checking that one.

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AA7, I don't agree with freedom of helmets on bike paths. I smashed my collarbone in a couple of places and 6 ribs on a bike path. The helmet saved my noggin. I crashed by myself.

 

Also, if you have ever ridden the M7, our friendly mad bunch riders would put a stop to your thinking.

 

 

 

FM

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AA7, I don't agree with freedom of helmets on bike paths. I smashed my collarbone in a couple of places and 6 ribs on a bike path. The helmet saved my noggin. I crashed by myself.

 

Also, if you have ever ridden the M7, our friendly mad bunch riders would put a stop to your thinking.

 

 

 

FM

 

Fair enough. I will always wear a helmet, I have no problem with it, but also think that if people want to make the choice for themselves not to wear one, go for it.

 

I too had a stupid, clumsy stack on a bike path and my helmet saved me from a cracked head.

 

Interestingly though, on my recent trip to Europe, I didn't always wear a helmet, some on bike paths but also on the road.

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The same as you have to have a working bell or horn on your bike. Can't remember the TO's ever checking that one.

Good point, you won't believe this but it's true, at one stage in Australia there was this thing called zippergate where you got pinged for not having your zipper done up but you could ride your bike without a bell.....crazy times at technical back then.

 

Get them on here, lets see if they think they are above the law and will enforce the rules to suit or wether they'll respect the Gay amendments.

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AA7, I don't agree with freedom of helmets on bike paths. I smashed my collarbone in a couple of places and 6 ribs on a bike path. The helmet saved my noggin. I crashed by myself.

 

Also, if you have ever ridden the M7, our friendly mad bunch riders would put a stop to your thinking.

 

 

 

FM

I think there's a difference between riding a town bike at 10-15 km/h wearing runners and with flat pedals versus a roadie at 25+ and wearing clip-ins. It's much easier to break a fall when you can stick your leg out and you're not going very fast.

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Good point, you won't believe this but it's true, at one stage in Australia there was this thing called zippergate where you got pinged for not having your zipper done up but you could ride your bike without a bell.....crazy times at technical back then.

 

Get them on here, lets see if they think they are above the law and will enforce the rules to suit or wether they'll respect the Gay amendments.

It's much easier to check for a horn with the zipper down. They should have realised that.

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So what constitutes a "cyclist" and in what scenario is carrying photo ID going to be required, cycle paths adjacent road infrastructure (e.g. Sydney CBD bike lanes), dual use cycle/pedestrian paths remote from road infrastructure (e.g. M7 bike path), sanctioned events on closed roads (e.g. triathlon), cycling events on cycling specific circuit (e.g. Lansdowne Bike Track), mountain biking on designated trails (e.g. Manley Dam), mountain biking in national parks (e.g. Oaks Fire Trail), riding track at a velodrome (e.g. Dunc Gray)

 

I'm sorry this is a bit Sydneycentric

 

Many of the above I would not expect the police to enforce the photo ID rule, but should they be able to considering that it may still be an offence

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Cyclists crying about this to the enth degree is no different to motorists having a teary about litteral interpretation/application of the 1m rule. FFS just suck it up and stop being a dried up old crotch wallet.

Edited by yoyo
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Cyclists crying about this to the enth degree is no different to motorists having a teary about litteral interpretation/application of the 1m rule. FFS just suck it up and stop being a dried up old crotch wallet.

Lol

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