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swanny

Swim Sets - I feel the need for speed!

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10 x 100 flat out on 3min then 10 x 50 flat out on 2 min. Dive start then climb out. No using stairs. If you have back niggles avoid this set till back improves. 15 dive starts can stir the ol' back up.

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And ffs people, you wanna swim, join a squad like coach@ and mrscoach@ run at engadine pool, there endeth the lesson.

 

Not always so easy.

Sent the Mrs to join the local squad as her stoke really sucked (unlike mine :lol: )

Master of ceremonies threw her in the deep end (figuratively speaking) and did nothing to fix her stroke.

She got really strong at swimming slowly....

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Lane 9 - steps make it easy for the middle-aged man to exit the pool with dignity :D

 

lol. I always leave via the steps now after cramping on exit a few months ago. Not a pretty site seeing a grown man trying to suppress a scream while laying on the pool deck clutching his leg. Especially when my daughter is getting lessons in the next lane! I think it's scarred me for life.

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What's the benefit of dive starts?

 

Dive starts are like flip turns, they allow real swimmers to laugh at the rest of us.

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And which side of the fence to you sit on D?

 

 

Kick is pretty important to be a good swimmer, however, it's not that important to being a good triathlon swimmer mainly since wearing a wettie solves most body position issues for crap swimmers.

 

I'm with fluoro. Learn to kick just enough to maintain a good body position, which, if you do it right, can be little more than a flick of the ankle, so no chance of trashing your legs before the bike.

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Interesting? I would have thought you would have a few extra stroked per length to add more fatigue. Maybe you could do a lap and then 10 star jumps, 20 pushups and run on the spot for a minute before the next one

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Guest Gimili

What's the benefit of dive starts?

 

Its like a relaxation technique at engadine pool, sort of takes the "cut the air with a knife" feeling, people relax, get a bit of a giggle.... Edited by Gimili

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Interesting? I would have thought you would have a few extra stroked per length to add more fatigue. Maybe you could do a lap and then 10 star jumps, 20 pushups and run on the spot for a minute before the next one

 

 

Dont laugh. I've swum in tri squads where they do make u do that sort of stuff.

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Guest Gimili

Interesting? I would have thought you would have a few extra stroked per length to add more fatigue. Maybe you could do a lap and then 10 star jumps, 20 pushups and run on the spot for a minute before the next one

 

dunks, it sorta works, like swim 4k or so through a squad, normally not more than 4.5 but not less than 4, then when its all done and dusted 10 or 12 diving 50's with run backs in between....... quickest person is real quick, slowest person is quick, everybody gets real fit.

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I dont think I have ever swam more than 10kms or 3 times a week and still swim just over 1 hour for IM. There are more ways to skin a cat than just knock out lap after lap or 10 x 50s.

 

FM

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I dont think I have ever swam more than 10kms or 3 times a week and still swim just over 1 hour for IM. There are more ways to skin a cat than just knock out lap after lap or 10 x 50s.

 

FM

 

What's your point ? That your way you haven't got any better? I wouldn't call that skinning a cat I'd call that leaving fleas on a dog......seriously why swim at all . Many people could swim once a month and swim over under an hour?

 

Thread was about improvement I thought

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What's your point ? That your way you haven't got any better? I wouldn't call that skinning a cat I'd call that leaving fleas on a dog......seriously why swim at all . Many people could swim once a month and swim over under an hour?

 

Thread was about improvement I thought

 

 

now now girls. perhaps a day or two off training is in order?

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Coupla general questions

 

1 when wr say 2m/100 or whatever what speed is that, race pace 1km tt or what you are able to swim at for days. Coz everyone can belt out a 1km swim in a pool. But tht time is generally alot faster than a choppy, crowded race swim

 

2 the whole just swim the distance vs intervals and speed work, is this the way to go with cycling and running.

 

3 Any good squads around bayside melbourne? When we say squad do we mean tri squad specific or do we mean any ol swim squad.

 

 

Adding my own 2 cents even though i am by absolutely no means qualified to do so. I would say slugging out slow km after slow km doesnt meet the specifity training principle especially if you are training for a OD. You need to do long intervals wouldnt you? such as 5x400? so you can work to some extent on improving your pace. I ran with a group of umpires twice a week amd was to scared to go into a faster group and as a result didnt get faster. My muscular endurance rose incredibly and this is important but speed stayed fairly similar except for small improvements that came through me maturing amd getting stronger mentally and physically. You need to do one set trying to go harder than normal no? or did i completely misunderstand what was going on?

 

really interesting thread with some great advice from some greats of the sport. Thanks guys!

Edited by triaddict

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What's your point ? That your way you haven't got any better? I wouldn't call that skinning a cat I'd call that leaving fleas on a dog......seriously why swim at all . Many people could swim once a month and swim over under an hour?

 

Thread was about improvement I thought

 

 

 

Jimmy C, yes I agree, the thread is improvement. Can you improve on time poor people or someone who is limited? Yes. Can you improve doing extra kms ? yes. So yes, this thread is about improvement. Mine is about drills driving improvement in stroke and power rather than big kms. Horses for courses.

 

BTW, not everyone can swim under 1 hour. Mine is about alternatives.

 

FM

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Guest Gimili

would add too, if you are not getting faster doing speed work.... ditch it and do paddle work..tyr catlyst paddles, the green ones

just be careful of your shoulders. that's pretty much what i took out of the collected works of the coach that shall not be named though is named in this thread.

 

he has some stuff of interest over on the teamtbb forum under "doc"

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why does everyone think that when you run swim or bike long you are going slow? this is the problem people think continuous = excuse to go slow

 

last time i checked IM=moderate aerobic pace. if you are the full bottle you should be able to do this hour after hour in training

 

you shouldnt need to stop and look at a clock to stop yourself swimming like a old woman

 

same thing on a long run- so many people brainwashed with long=slow beyond belief

 

just go long and keep it aerobic

 

that can actually be quite "fast"

 

why do we always want to make it one extreme pigeonhole ?

 

kid yourself all you want but if swimming,biking or running at your target IM pace for the full distance of each leg cant be done quite comfortably in training then........

 

no rainbow is going to hit you on the arse come race day

 

i'll bet $50 that 7/10 people on this board would get more out of swimming a solid hour at their best aerobic pace than trying to smash out intervals at anaerobic pace

particularly those that swim 2x a week

 

the same people that seldom improve and want a rainbow all the time- cant understand why they beat everyone in a pool and that "slow old hacker" knocking out the laps thumps them come race day

 

just think about it- not everything that gets said all the time is relevant- people see that "quick" guy putting the icing on the cake by doing his fast intervals. what they dont see is all the hours he's going up and down on his own at a solid but comfortable pace building the cake itself

Edited by Jimmy C

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Good point. Thank you. I thought we were just slugging as long as you could go for. I understand now. Thanks jimmy c. Been alot of help

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Also just another question, talking about sustaining 15 km weeks and working hard when really needing to speed up, i think it was jimmy c talking about jackie gallagher? saying she put in some ~30km weeks and got it to where it needs to be.

For those of us who dont have time for 30km weeks in the pool, (i can struggle enough with 15) do you suggest we do a solid season of working our arses off in the pool with a little less focus on running and riding (especially if we are in it for the long haul) and have that base for swimming then simply maintain it, obviously improving but as you have been saying swimming consistently will improve you. Or just do the miles in all disciplines and let it still be weaker than all the others.

For me it is a problem and easily my weakest leg. Would you say get it up the level of the ride and the run and then the next year go back into a more even spread. Seeing the body as ever evolving and no season and those philosophies...

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Also just another question, talking about sustaining 15 km weeks and working hard when really needing to speed up, i think it was jimmy c talking about jackie gallagher? saying she put in some ~30km weeks and got it to where it needs to be.

For those of us who dont have time for 30km weeks in the pool, (i can struggle enough with 15) do you suggest we do a solid season of working our arses off in the pool with a little less focus on running and riding (especially if we are in it for the long haul) and have that base for swimming then simply maintain it, obviously improving but as you have been saying swimming consistently will improve you. Or just do the miles in all disciplines and let it still be weaker than all the others.

For me it is a problem and easily my weakest leg. Would you say get it up the level of the ride and the run and then the next year go back into a more even spread. Seeing the body as ever evolving and no season and those philosophies...

 

 

Yes,

 

I never started swimming until I was 27.....For about a year I swam very consistently for 3 days a week. managed to move by swimming down to a 1:45/100 base

 

In the off season I decided to do a swim focus, moved up to 5-6 sessions PW, consistently hitting 15-25km PW....After 3-4months I could comfortably hold 15 x 100, on a 1:30 base (that was the goal). Even managed to pull off 8 x 100 on a 1:20 base (couldn't crack 10).

 

My only drill work was to try and emulate the styles of the good swimmers in the faster lane next to me. Other than that, lot's of fast swimming, paddle work, band only work and the occasional pull buoy.

 

It will work if you set aside the time, swim with a good COACH in a SQUAD and go for it.

 

It's not pool swimming fast but did allow me to exit with the front pack in every local triathlon after that.

 

fluro

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